@mechajutaro said:

@Innovator said:

https://variety.com/2022/film/news/roland-emmerich-marvel-stars-ruining-film-industry-1235170497/

"Marvel and DC Comics and Star Wars have pretty much taken over. It’s ruining our industry a little bit, because nobody does anything original anymore.” Roland Emmerich said this....Roland "Disaster Shlock" Emmerich said this...are you kidding me? 😂

The more Hollywood insiders who finally work up the courage to say publicly what the viewing public has been saying for eons now, the better. Whatever one wants to say about Emmerich's flicks, they at least featured real humans and weren't little more than set-ups for even more sequels. That in and of itself is an immense improvement over the franchise heavy landscape of contemporary cinema

He doesn't need to make sequels when he makes the same movie over and over again. Also have you seen Moonfall? I just came back from it, and I can tell there's absolutely nothing real about that. 🤣

@Innovator said:

Also, he doesn't need to make sequels when he makes the same movie over and over again. Also have you seen Moonfall? I just came back from it, and I can tell there's absolutely nothing real about that. 🤣

At least the moon is not an egg. What is it? Perhaps Fran knows.

If the point of the movie is to entertain and grab your curiosity along the way, helps your imagination as well, Moonfall did a good job. The real issue is wanting to go to your local cinema for any other movie than a Marvel or Star Wars.

@mechajutaro said:

@Em1l3_M4n4r1y0 said:

If the point of the movie is to entertain and grab your curiosity along the way, helps your imagination as well, Moonfall did a good job. The real issue is wanting to go to your local cinema for any other movie than a Marvel or Star Wars.

Exactly

Mech, Moonfall is in cinemas now you can watch it anytime you want and repeatedly if you want without Marvel or Star Wars, send me the link of your local cinema and I'll find available times you can go and watch Moonfall.

@mechajutaro said:

@Innovator said:

@mechajutaro said:

@Innovator said:

https://variety.com/2022/film/news/roland-emmerich-marvel-stars-ruining-film-industry-1235170497/

"Marvel and DC Comics and Star Wars have pretty much taken over. It’s ruining our industry a little bit, because nobody does anything original anymore.” Roland Emmerich said this....Roland "Disaster Shlock" Emmerich said this...are you kidding me? 😂

The more Hollywood insiders who finally work up the courage to say publicly what the viewing public has been saying for eons now, the better. Whatever one wants to say about Emmerich's flicks, they at least featured real humans and weren't little more than set-ups for even more sequels. That in and of itself is an immense improvement over the franchise heavy landscape of contemporary cinema

He doesn't need to make sequels when he makes the same movie over and over again. Also have you seen Moonfall? I just came back from it, and I can tell there's absolutely nothing real about that. 🤣

No one is expecting realism all the time whenever we got to the multiplexes. As much as we may have b-tched about Independence Day and Armageddon back in the 90s though, here in '22 it's all but impossible to not mourn for days when we saw flesh and blood human beings without the powers of flight or lasers shooting out their eyes going into space and saving the world

Practically everyone (in IRL and the movies) that goes into space to save the world flies, and rarely can they shoot lasers out of their eyes. 😅

I should have explained myself more, the earlier comment was reinforcing Roland's point, in that regardless of what Marvel movie comes out everyone makes it a point to go to the cinemas, due to their popularity, it's what everyone talks about and wants. I've noticed some critics are in favour of Marvel movies in their ratings, rarely do they talk about them in a negative way, the same thing happens in the general audience too. I think Roland is pointing out those things too, saying to the audience, critics and the mega studios that there are still filmmakers around with fresh diverse ideas. That those ideas should be given a chance. I would go on to say that Moonfall might be ripped apart by critics, who also fail to do the same on those Marvel movies, it's like marvel movies have become the standard or like there's a certain formula to filmmaking. I don't think that should be the case.

@Em1l3_M4n4r1y0 said:

I should have explained myself more, the earlier comment was reinforcing Roland's point, in that regardless of what Marvel movie comes out everyone makes it a point to go to the cinemas, due to their popularity, it's what everyone talks about and wants. I've noticed some critics are in favour of Marvel movies in their ratings, rarely do they talk about them in a negative way, the same thing happens in the general audience too. I think Roland is pointing out those things too, saying to the audience, critics and the mega studios that there are still filmmakers around with fresh diverse ideas. That those ideas should be given a chance. I would go on to say that Moonfall might be ripped apart by critics, who also fail to do the same on those Marvel movies, it's like marvel movies have become the standard or like there's a certain formula to filmmaking. I don't think that should be the case.

You were talking about being unable or being prevented in some way, shape or form from watching non Marvel or non Star Wars movies not critic favoritism. Filmmakers will decide what makes them the most money if it means copying the Marvel formula then that's it. Variety for the sake of variety isn't always good either that's what you don't seem to understand too.

@Adammm said:

@mechajutaro said:

@Em1l3_M4n4r1y0 said:

If the point of the movie is to entertain and grab your curiosity along the way, helps your imagination as well, Moonfall did a good job. The real issue is wanting to go to your local cinema for any other movie than a Marvel or Star Wars.

Exactly

Mech, Moonfall is in cinemas now you can watch it anytime you want and repeatedly if you want without Marvel or Star Wars, send me the link of your local cinema and I'll find available times you can go and watch Moonfall.

While I certainly sympathize with those who complain about the trend for superhero and other franchise movies, it is a bit overwhelming. I do think it can be exaggerated when they say that other, original films aren't made as a result. But is Moonfall or any of Emmerich's general output really the best example of this?

I haven't seen Moonfall and I'm not going to so I'll never know whether it is some sort of critics bias or not, but I've seen five of Emmerich's films since Independence Day and four of them were absolute balls. Godzilla, The Day After Tomorrow, 2012 and Independence Day 2 (I liked The Patriot at the time but that was a long time ago, not sure if I still would now). So I have little motivation to take a risk on Moonfall. If it's the choice between a shitty Emmerich film and a half decent super hero film then I'm going with the super hero film. So the idea of him criticizing the super hero trend is absolutely ridiculous. If he wanted people to go see his "original" films he should have stopped making shit ones a long time ago. The guys got no one to blame but himself.

On the other hand, a big reason we don't get as many original films as many would like is because when a decent one does get made people often don't go and watch it. They ignore it. They'll go see the superhero film of course. Then complain about it endlessly. They'll moan about the state of the industry one second but won't actually seek out and watch and encourage the films they are asking for. The next time a film comes out that is supposed to be good and isn't a franchise/superhero film, go and see it. Tell the studios what you want. Not just with words on a forum but with your money.

I've seen Moonfall, and it can be described as high budget Asylum film. It's crap like this that's ruining cinema, as it's causing people to not want to go to the movies if it's not from "Marvel and DC Comics and Star Wars" (as Emmeric put it). Emmeric has no one to blame but himself, considering the money from Moonfall didn't even come from a studio, but raised by him though investors in China. The faults in this movie can only be attributed to him, as it's basically an indy film. So congratz, Emmeric, on your "original film"! 🤣

@JustinJackFlash said:

@Adammm said:

@mechajutaro said:

@Em1l3_M4n4r1y0 said:

If the point of the movie is to entertain and grab your curiosity along the way, helps your imagination as well, Moonfall did a good job. The real issue is wanting to go to your local cinema for any other movie than a Marvel or Star Wars.

Exactly

Mech, Moonfall is in cinemas now you can watch it anytime you want and repeatedly if you want without Marvel or Star Wars, send me the link of your local cinema and I'll find available times you can go and watch Moonfall.

While I certainly sympathize with those who complain about the trend for superhero and other franchise movies, it is a bit overwhelming. I do think it can be exaggerated when they say that other, original films aren't made as a result. But is Moonfall or any of Emmerich's general output really the best example of this?

I haven't seen Moonfall and I'm not going to so I'll never know whether it is some sort of critics bias or not, but I've seen five of Emmerich's films since Independence Day and four of them were absolute balls. Godzilla, The Day After Tomorrow, 2012 and Independence Day 2 (I liked The Patriot at the time but that was a long time ago, not sure if I still would now). So I have little motivation to take a risk on Moonfall. If it's the choice between a shitty Emmerich film and a half decent super hero film then I'm going with the super hero film. So the idea of him criticizing the super hero trend is absolutely ridiculous. If he wanted people to go see his "original" films he should have stopped making shit ones a long time ago. The guys got no one to blame but himself.

On the other hand, a big reason we don't get as many original films as many would like is because when a decent one does get made people often don't go and watch it. They ignore it. They'll go see the superhero film of course. Then complain about it endlessly. They'll moan about the state of the industry one second but won't actually seek out and watch and encourage the films they are asking for. The next time a film comes out that is supposed to be good and isn't a franchise/superhero film, go and see it. Tell the studios what you want. Not just with words on a forum but with your money.

They can't be sympathized with because the variety is still there and will always be there, people like Mechajutaro or other nihilists need to separate audience demand from comic book movie dominance. DC and Marvel can throw billions or trillions into a movie but they can't force you to watch their movies it's their trailers job to convince. An adult needs to understand that it's the survival of the fittest when it comes to box office. People with genuine real worries can be sympathized with not nihilistic fantasists.

@mechajutaro said:

DC and Marvel can throw billions or trillions into a movie but they can't force you to watch their movies it's their trailers job to convince.

Eternals and Shang Chi(neither or which have the pandemic as an excuse to fall back on)played mostly to empty auditoriums., and The DCEU's profitability has been erratic at best. Clearly then, they haven't been successful at forcing filmgoers to turn out for their most recent productions. Spiderman, Far From Home(which I've had only complimentary things to say about)has been the sole exception here

No, they have exactly the pandemic as excuses both films were released prior to third Covid vaccines, do you live in a cave? Don't want to be harsh towards you but I'm not sure if you sounding not up to date on current affairs is meant to make you look endearing to users on here or charming or not but it's not working that way for me.

@mechajutaro said:

No, they have exactly the pandemic as excuses both films were released prior to third Covid vaccines

Not prior to the initial two vaccines though; movie theaters had been opened up for a minute when Eternals and Shang Chi appeared. Black Widow can fall back on that crutch to a degree; not these two though. Marvel's got some nerve, Adam, if they're not paying you a stipend to appear on these boards and any others you might frequent, all for the express purpose of trying to convince skeptics that Feige and the gang can do no wrong

There were still heavy death numbers in the United States and in Europe again I'm not sure Moonfall space mission of your own that you were during those months. Cinema tripd were tentative in those months. And as I said if the decline is as evident as you're making it to be that still doesn't explain your paranoia. The DCEU is erratic but their box office is nothing to laugh at. I don't need to convince anyone DC and Marvel have been stomping the competition regardless of what I say to you or not. And let's be honest if you were so sure of the cinematic decline you wouldn't be distressed.

@mechajutaro said:

While I certainly sympathize with those who complain about the trend for superhero and other franchise movies, it is a bit overwhelming. I do think it can be exaggerated when they say that other, original films aren't made as a result.

Neither myself nor anyone else who's called out the pervasiveness of superhero, franchise flicks, and reboots of stale IPs has ever claimed that original films aren't being made. For every Sicario or Triple 9 though, there's been 50 more cape films, Jurassic Park flicks, or dredging up of IPs like Charlie's Angel and now Indiana Jones. No one is calling for a landscape where high concept films like this have been purged from the market completely, nonetheless the stranglehold they currently exert over the mainstream market has led to an infantilization of our popular culture. We can have a whole separate discussion on China's influence on Hollywood, and the fact that audiences in Beijing devour these live action cartoons like Artie Lange ploughing through lines of cocaine serves as a disincentive to put out different types of movies

But is Moonfall or any of Emmerich's general output really the best example of this?

I haven't seen Moonfall and I'm not going to so I'll never know whether it is some sort of critics bias or not, but I've seen five of Emmerich's films since Independence Day and four of them were absolute balls. Godzilla, The Day After Tomorrow, 2012 and Independence Day 2 (I liked The Patriot at the time but that was a long time ago, not sure if I still would now). So I have little motivation to take a risk on Moonfall. If it's the choice between a ****** Emmerich film and a half decent super hero film then I'm going with the super hero film. So the idea of him criticizing the super hero trend is absolutely ridiculous. If he wanted people to go see his "original" films he should have stopped making **** ones a long time ago. The guys got no one to blame but himself.

Whether or not Emmerich is a great filmmaker isn't what's in question here though. We're discussing the remarks he made, and investigating the veracity of those remarks. Just as if a homeless man got on TV and said something about World War II being more complicated than Allies Good, Third Reich Bad, it would be sloppy logic for us to focus myopically on his finical status, rather than exploring whether or not the evidence backs up what his assertion

On the other hand, a big reason we don't get as many original films as many would like is because when a decent one does get made people often don't go and watch it. They ignore it. They'll go see the superhero film of course. Then complain about it endlessly. They'll moan about the state of the industry one second but won't actually seek out and watch and encourage the films they are asking for. The next time a film comes out that is supposed to be good and isn't a franchise/superhero film, go and see it. Tell the studios what you want. Not just with words on a forum but with your money.

Lots of first-rate movies are ending up on streaming. Talking here movies like "Slow West", "The Skeleton Twins", "X/X", "Brawl in Cell Block 99", "Frank", "The Forgiven", etc etc. Again, the stranglehold that high concept films current exert on the mainstream market have created an environment where these films get either very limited-to no release at all on the mainstream market, which wasn't the case up until fairly recently. Hell, even flawed debut films from directors who clearly have a great deal of talent, such as The Voyeurs are being consigned to streaming, whereas in the not too distant past they would have received theatrical runs. Everyone, from Hollywood insiders to run of the mill fans have to make some noise about this, if we want things to change

Voyeurs was abhorrent and hilarious, but let's not even get started on the slight skinny woman able to drag a grown man's body into a hanging position above the living room, the girl fucking her neighbour at the slightest hint of a domestic and you have the nerve to talk about infantilization. See what I mean by variety not always being of good quality or particularly intelligent. Ben Hardy was good in spite of Voyeurs not because of it.

@mechajutaro said:

Voyeurs was abhorrent and hilarious, but let's not even get started on the slight skinny woman able to drag a grown man's body into a hanging position above the living room, the girl ******* her neighbour at the slightest hint of a domestic and you have the nerve to talk about infantilization. See what I mean by variety not always being of good quality or particularly intelligent. Ben Hardy was good in spite of Voyeurs not because of it

We're in agreement, in regards to Ben Hardy's performance; hell, I'd commend the entire cast, except the dude who played Sidney Sweeney's boyfriend. Insofar as my alleged nerve goes, re-read what i actually wrote..... "Hell, even flawed debut films from directors who clearly have a great deal of talent, such as The Voyeurs are being consigned to streaming, whereas in the not too distant past they would have received theatrical runs."

I didn't so much as imply that it was a great movie. Consuming way too many cape movies has destroyed the capacity of many of us to follow a point. More variety in our multiplexes is going to be a welcome development, as it slowly creeps back in

No, they've destroyed your ability to follow a point no one else. And it's already a development.

@mechajutaro said:

@Adammm said:

@mechajutaro said:

Voyeurs was abhorrent and hilarious, but let's not even get started on the slight skinny woman able to drag a grown man's body into a hanging position above the living room, the girl ******* her neighbour at the slightest hint of a domestic and you have the nerve to talk about infantilization. See what I mean by variety not always being of good quality or particularly intelligent. Ben Hardy was good in spite of Voyeurs not because of it

We're in agreement, in regards to Ben Hardy's performance; hell, I'd commend the entire cast, except the dude who played Sidney Sweeney's boyfriend. Insofar as my alleged nerve goes, re-read what i actually wrote..... "Hell, even flawed debut films from directors who clearly have a great deal of talent, such as The Voyeurs are being consigned to streaming, whereas in the not too distant past they would have received theatrical runs."

I didn't so much as imply that it was a great movie. Consuming way too many cape movies has destroyed the capacity of many of us to follow a point. More variety in our multiplexes is going to be a welcome development, as it slowly creeps back in

No, they've destroyed your ability to follow a point no one else. And it's already a development.

You're now down to essentially screeching "You did to!!!", and mistaking that for an argument. I encourage you to lay off The Avengers marathons, in favor of learning how to disagree

How to accept things and let things be and change what you can or are able to change would be my advice to you too.