@JustinJackFlash said:

@Innovator said:

I actually get so much "woke" naysayers from YouTube daily, my do not recommend list is longer than my list of subscriptions, and the reason my eye twitches now every time I hear someone IRL says the word "woke". 🤥

Wouldn't the fact that you get such recommendations so much despite it not being a viewpoint you support or have pursued suggest that it's not a vocal minority? As well as hearing it in real life a lot too.

Still not even close to those with the direct opposite or even "meh" viewpoints on the whole thing. So much so, I've gotten it pretty much all "woke" spouting naysayers eliminated on my PC version of YouTube (only get it once in a while now). Unfortunately, not on my Apple TV, which doesn't have the don't recommend feature. Also, most of the IRL comes from several of my family members who are Trump supporting, antivaxxers, as well as Biden haters. So I hear crap spew from them weekly.

@mechajutaro said:

@Innovator said:

@mechajutaro said:

@Innovator said:

@mechajutaro said:

@Innovator said:

@mechajutaro said:

@Innovator said:

@mechajutaro said:

Serendipitously, we've been blessed with fresh elaboration on this subject

Elaboration of what? Chinese investors funded Emmerich's Moonfall.

https://www.hollywoodreporter.com/news/general-news/roland-emmerichs-moonfall-secures-chinese-funding-bowing-2021-1252952/

At one point in the interview, Gross lists all China's stipulations on the sort of American films they're willing to give screen time to. Meeting all of those stipulations pretty much translates into the studios churning out movies with storylines, characters, and scenarios that don't extend very far beyond 4th grade level writing. Yes, high concept movies have been around since the earliest days of Hollywood, nonetheless the industry capitulating to Beijing's every whim has led to the studios playing it safe by investing in cape movies and flicks about dinosaurs, rather than taking a good long hard look into what they can do to get audiences back into the multiplexes here in The US; this is a development that predates the pandemic. Tinseltown has thus been disincentivized from producing "edgier" content, thanks in no small part to the machinations of one of the most totalitarian regimes on the face of the planet

Even without the influence of Woke Thought, it would be almost unimaginable for any major studio today to put out a movie like Basic Instinct. Of course, the fella being interviewed did say that China is increasingly promoting it's own films once again, and becoming less receptive to Western cinema once more. Perhaps this will translate into more diverse menus at our multiplexes here in The US

Except no cape movies played in China last year. 😏

That'd be a sufficient explanation, IF we're only discussing last year. We're talking about the landscape of US cinema, from the mid-10s forward. All these denials of reality offered up folks like yourself rely on dodging the evidence it's totality

You mean like the LGBTQ+ inclusion in the films these days that are in direct opposition of what Chinese censors would approve (and the vocal minority consider woke)? 😏

Aside from Eternals, there's been very few openly gay and almost no tr-nny characters in The MCU or tentpole flicks more broadly. That conspicuous representation of the LGBTQXZI community occurs on TV more than anywhere else, much of which IS NOT available in China. You're running out of ducks and dives, hoss, though you're persistence in trying to obfuscate the glaringly apparent facts is remarkable

Cruella, Deadpool 2, Star Trek Beyond, Rise of Skywalker, Birds of Prey, Avengers: Endgame...the future promises even more LGBTQ+ Marvel characters like American Chavez, Wiccan, and Nico Minoru, and who knows who else.

Didn't see Cruella, so I can't comment. Star Trek Beyond barely hints at Sulu's preference for pole over beaver, I'm not aware of any gay or trans characters in Birds Of Prey(even if the cast did dress up like tr-nnies), Avengers Endgame didn't have any openly gay characters or trans ones. The first Deadpool movie was never released in China, and Fox bowed to Beijing, by toning down the second film enough for a release there

Are American Chavez and all those other ones going to be characters in movies or TV shows?

Cruella has a trans seamstress who helped her carry out her schemes. Yes Endgame did have a gay character, played by Joe Russo himself. Harley states she's Montoya's ex in Birds of Prey. As for Deadpool 2 doesn't not being played in China go against the argument that all blockbusters have to cater to China? American Chavez is one of the main characters in Doctor Strange 2: Multiverse of Madness. Wiccan is Wanda's son, who's also slated to appear in that movie as well and the future Young/New Avengers movie. Both characters are openly gay in the comics, the latter partnered with another Young Avenger, a male Skrull called Hulkling. Nico Minoru (aka Sister Grimm) has appeared in the Runaways TV series, is rumored to soon helm her own show and as well as appear as a future member of the Young Avengers, which Marvel is currently building up.

@mechajutaro said:

Cruella has a trans seamstress who helped her carry out her schemes.

Any word as to whether or not Cruella was edited down for it's Chinese release? How overtly trans was this character you speak of? In any event, Hollywood is justifiably taking fewer and fewer gambles on movies like this(stories based on one-note villains in Disney movies, that is), given their tepid performances at the box office, both stateside and domestically. This particular fad in filmmaking thus isn't especially relevant to the topic at hand

Yes Endgame did have a gay character, played by Joe Russo himself.

This cameo , that lasts barely a minute, you mean?

Harley states she's Montoya's ex in Birds of Prey.

For we all we know, this line was altered in the dubbing for The Chinese release. Dubbed to omit any mention of Harley having dipping her tongue into the pink

As for Deadpool 2 doesn't not being played in China go against the argument that all blockbusters have to cater to China?

Dead pool I wasn't released in China, on account of it's content. II WAS deliberately watered down to appease the censors in Red Beijing

American Chavez is one of the main characters in Doctor Strange 2: Multiverse of Madness. Wiccan is Wanda's son, who's also slated to appear in that movie as well and the future Young/New Avengers movie.

We have no idea how "out" he's going to be either. This is to say nothing of the fact that future of Phase II remains highly uncertain at the moment, given that only Far From Home has raked in dough comparable to that of Iron Man and The Avengers movies. Whether or not we get a Young/New Avengers movie/movies is far from guaranteed

Nico Minoru (aka Sister Grim) has appeared in the Runaways TV series, is rumored to soon helm her own show and as well as appear as a future member of the Young Avengers.

Again, those are streaming shows, many if not most of which aren't legally or widely available in China. They aren't applicable to this discussion, which is centered around mainstream Hollywood releases. And as said prior, whether or not this Young Avengers era of the franchise will come to pass, and whether or not it will prove to be anywhere near as lucrative as Phase I remains to be seen

The trans character in Cruella was overtly trans in that she always appeared wearing women's clothing. I don't know if the character was edited out in China. https://www.them.us/story/disney-cruella-gay-character-pissing-off-conservatives

I did say who knows what the future holds. Also they're clearly building up a Young Avengers team as it's members have been appearing in the MCU during this phase; Kate Bishop (Hawkeye), Cassie Lang (Stature to be appearing in Ant-man Quantumania), Elijah Bradley (Patriot appeared in Falcon and The Winter Soldier), Tommy & Billy (Wiccan & Speed appeared in Wandavison and soon to appear on the new Doctor Strange Movie), America Chavez (Ms. America also in Doctor Strange), Kid Loki (appeared in Loki), Kamala Khan (Ms. Marvel), Riri Williams (Ironheart), and Nico Minaru (Sister Grimm who appeared in Runaways). The only ones yet slated to appear is Iron Lad and Hulkling.

@Innovator said:

Still not even close to those with the direct opposite or even "meh" viewpoints on the whole thing. So much so, I've gotten it pretty much all "woke" spouting naysayers eliminated on my PC version of YouTube (only get it once in a while now). Unfortunately, not on my Apple TV, which doesn't have the don't recommend feature. Also, most of the IRL comes from several of my family members who are Trump supporting, antivaxxers, as well as Biden haters. So I hear crap spew from them weekly.

Could it be possible that because these family members are Trump supporting antivaxxers that this might lead you to the assumption that every person who criticizes "woke" culture is a Trump supporting antivaxxer? And therefore not entertain anything they say.

@JustinJackFlash said:

@Innovator said:

Still not even close to those with the direct opposite or even "meh" viewpoints on the whole thing. So much so, I've gotten it pretty much all "woke" spouting naysayers eliminated on my PC version of YouTube (only get it once in a while now). Unfortunately, not on my Apple TV, which doesn't have the don't recommend feature. Also, most of the IRL comes from several of my family members who are Trump supporting, antivaxxers, as well as Biden haters. So I hear crap spew from them weekly.

Could it be possible that because these family members are Trump supporting antivaxxers that this might lead you to the assumption that every person who criticizes "woke" culture is a Trump supporting antivaxxer? And therefore not entertain anything they say.

The others I've known IRL are just misogynistic boomers. Don't get me wrong, they're my closet friends, but they're still very much misogynistic boomers. 🙄

@mechajutaro said:

I did say who knows what the future holds. Also they're clearly building up a Young Avengers team as it's members have been appearing in the MCU during this phase; Kate Bishop (Hawkeye), Cassie Lang (Stature to be appearing in Ant-man Quantumania), Elijah Bradley (Patriot appeared in Falcon and The Winter Soldier), Tommy & Billy (Wiccan & Speed appeared in Wandavison and soon to appear on the new Doctor Strange Movie), America Chavez (Ms. America also in Doctor Strange), Kid Loki (appeared in Loki), Kamala Khan (Ms. Marvel), Riri Williams (Ironheart), and Nico Minaru (Sister Grimm who appeared in Runaways). The only ones yet slated to appear is Iron Lad and Hulkling.

Most of those folks you mentioned have appeared in streaming shows, not The MCU. If they're not overly out in the next Dr Strange film or those references are edited from The Chinese release, then it's going to be really tough to keep denying Beijing's influence over the industry. When we already have so much exhaustive evidence(again, listen to the link I provided)that this is case, it's bizarre that anyone outside of China would continue to deny it

What makes you think China is even going to allow Doctor Strange (or even any other future Marvel property)? They haven't even shown No Way Home yet (even though they've already announced a China release date for Uncharted). China clearly has an issue with Marvel/Disney at the moment.

@mechajutaro said:

@Innovator said:

@mechajutaro said:

I did say who knows what the future holds. Also they're clearly building up a Young Avengers team as it's members have been appearing in the MCU during this phase; Kate Bishop (Hawkeye), Cassie Lang (Stature to be appearing in Ant-man Quantumania), Elijah Bradley (Patriot appeared in Falcon and The Winter Soldier), Tommy & Billy (Wiccan & Speed appeared in Wandavison and soon to appear on the new Doctor Strange Movie), America Chavez (Ms. America also in Doctor Strange), Kid Loki (appeared in Loki), Kamala Khan (Ms. Marvel), Riri Williams (Ironheart), and Nico Minaru (Sister Grimm who appeared in Runaways). The only ones yet slated to appear is Iron Lad and Hulkling.

Most of those folks you mentioned have appeared in streaming shows, not The MCU. If they're not overly out in the next Dr Strange film or those references are edited from The Chinese release, then it's going to be really tough to keep denying Beijing's influence over the industry. When we already have so much exhaustive evidence(again, listen to the link I provided)that this is case, it's bizarre that anyone outside of China would continue to deny it

What makes you think China is even going to allow Doctor Strange (or even any other future Marvel property)? They haven't even shown No Way Home yet (even though they've already announced a China release date for Uncharted). China clearly has an issue with Marvel/Disney at the moment.

We're discussing the sanitizing influence China has had on the market since the mid-10s-today. Again, homing in only on a couple of impending releases is a deliberate of avoidance of the evidence in it's totality

We'll see at the end of the year I guess. Though I expect you won't take any examples this year either if China denies all of them as well.