@genplant29 said: It was heartbreaking how things played out- and certainly a very weird dinner party!

VERY weird, genplant! It was a TREMENDOUS relief when the editor cut the scene during Diana's attempted aria. By that time I was reaching for the remote to mute my TV - I couldn't have taken one more moment of her mania. O.M.G. I know bi-polar people and unfortunately they can be examples of why it's sometimes challenging to muster up sympathy for mental illness: one person I know made a NYE dinner insufferable with her constant (and I mean CONSTANT) complaints -- even about the salt and pepper shakers (the put-upon waiter got a huge tip from us for his forbearance).

It was interesting in this episode to be reminded that LSD was regarded with such hope for the treatment of mental illness, a hope that ended up unfulfilled. I guess the effects of it just aren't predictable enough for clinical use compared to other psychoactive drugs.

I laughed when Leonard said Mrs. C was "the voice of God" because she knows scripture and its context so well. Still, the poor woman seems to struggle with biblical lessons of joy, love and forgiveness. I've often wondered how people in her age group, who were little children during WWI, then suffered through the Great Depression, and survived yet another World War, managed to avoid being overwhelmed by cynicism and/or mental illness. I can't imagine...

Will's abrupt decision to "take the plunge" was an awkward surprise. Ellie was right to remark that they don't know each other very well. Besides, she may be too modern for him anyway. This period of time was considered the early years of The Atomic Age, and while the threat of nuclear weapons was undoubtedly a huge cloud overhead, I wonder if the advent of birth control pills had more of an impact on society and culture? Or maybe the combination of the two is what caused so much upheaval? If this show goes on long enough, I hate to think how Mrs. C will deal with the Swinging Sixties!

Just finished watching episode 3. I knew I wasn't going to like Will! I wish Sydney would come back.

To me, it was a thought-provoking episode, mainly because I was so surprised about Cathy's mother's mental illness -- I didn't see it coming, even when Cathy was on the phone with (I presume) her sister, and neither she nor the other sisters (I presume again) were willing to have their mother visit. Diana evidently wore out her welcome, but I didn't suspect bipolar disorder until she went berserk at dinner -- she just seemed energetic but overbearing until then. Whew. Too bad she burned the bombe or baked Alaska or whatever it was -- it looked tasty!

I'm beginning to agree with you about Will, bratface. But I wasn't crazy about Sidney either! They've both grappled with so many personal demons, it's kind of wearying. Eloquent sermons though... and now Leonard's father's coming to stay at the vicarage. Yikes, what a holy trinity.

@merryapril said:

To me, it was a thought-provoking episode, mainly because I was so surprised about Cathy's mother's mental illness -- I didn't see it coming, even when Cathy was on the phone with (I presume) her sister, and neither she nor the other sisters (I presume again) were willing to have their mother visit. Diana evidently wore out her welcome, but I didn't suspect bipolar disorder until she went berserk at dinner -- she just seemed energetic but overbearing until then. Whew. Too bad she burned the bombe or baked Alaska or whatever it was -- it looked tasty!

I'm beginning to agree with you about Will, bratface. But I wasn't crazy about Sidney either! They've both grappled with so many personal demons, it's kind of wearying. Eloquent sermons though... and now Leonard's father's coming to stay at the vicarage. Yikes, what a holy trinity.

I am one episode behind the rest of you, so I haven't seen Diana's meltdown yet (although I could see the signs when she returned home with the children after their day out in episode 3). We have two PBS stations in my area but the main one refuses to come in on my TV so I watch most (KBTC doesn't always air all PBS shows) on the 'redheaded stepchild' KBTC. We are 10 days behind. Sundays episodes (July 5) will air on KBTC on Monday the 13th.

I loved Sydney & James Norton (sexiest ginger around), his foibles are why I liked him.

I haven't caught back up on this thread since Sunday night right after E4 aired, but intend to soon.

For now, I want to ask why did James Norton leave the show last year? (I never heard the reason at the time.) I'm guessing to pursue other career opportunities? (I hate when an actor/actress I like, on a popular series, does that - then I never see them in anything anymore! Incidentally, I'm a fan of Norton from the excellent - and at times decidedly brutal - Happy Valley, in which he gives an outstanding, riveting performance.)

Will is the only vicar I've known on Grantchester, since I started watching when he began; I hadn't watched during the prior seasons, realized this is a good show (I'd off and on seen bits and pieces of some scattered episodes), so figured (correctly) that with the arrival of the new vicar would be a good entry point as a new viewer.

I've all along liked and been entirely pleased with both the character of Will and the actor (Tom Brittney) portraying him. Too, I totally "get" the complexities of the conflicted character (so readily am able to like him fully and not hold "issues" against him), due to my own staunchly RC (I realize Will is CoE) upbringing by a very devout mother (not to mention my late eldest sister [22 years my senior] was a nun for around 10 years [starting not long before I was born], and my late closest-in-age brother was a 7-1/2 years seminarian intending to become a priest [he wound up deciding, about 6 months shy of ordination, to follow a different path]). So Will's mindset is entirely understandable to me, and not at all off-putting; I realize he can't help being conflicted, and somewhat messed up (though overall otherwise a great guy), like he is.

Ellie has her work cut out for her with him!

Don't get me wrong, I really like the show - it's entertaining - in spite of finding the characters Sidney's and Will's personal baggage tiresome at times! I'm awaiting the release here in the US of The Trial of Christine Keeler, a BBC miniseries production in which James Norton portrays the infamous Keeler pimp Stephen Ward, a role played by the late and very great John Hurt in the 1989 film Scandal. I don't think you'll like Norton in it though bratface -- his hair is brown in the series!

I can only guess, to answer your question genplant, that like so many actors before him Norton didn't want to be associated too much with a popular role, and thought after 4 seasons it was time to move on.

I think I've seen James Norton in another series or two (possibly more than two) of recent years, though can't recall exactly what (no doubt some PBS Masterpiece period drama), if so.

I saw him in a miniseries version of War and Peace a few years ago, in the key role of Andrei. In looking at his filmography, I wonder if we just haven't gotten all of the shows here in the US - so many are unfamiliar to me. But there are too many broadcasters these days which require subscriptions, that I really don't know for sure.

@genplant29 said:

...(W)hy did James Norton leave the show last year?

Here is one interview from PBS:

https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/masterpiece/specialfeatures/james-norton-interview/#

One from 'Radio Times' (Contains mostly the same as the PBS one):

https://www.radiotimes.com/news/tv/2018-12-14/james-norton-leaving-grantchester-series-4-replacement/

Here's an interview with Robson Green where talks about leaving also:

http://britishperioddramas.com/news/grantchester-star-robson-green-nearly-quit-when-james-norton-left/

As already mentioned, James Norton intended to leave at the end of season three.

"It’s been such an emotional decision, I’ve loved this job so much and I owe the show an enormous amount. Robson has been the best partner in crime both on and off screen, it’s no secret that we have the most amazing bromance! When Sidney’s storyline with Amanda (his on-off girlfriend) was tied up and he choose the church over her, it seemed like that was the natural conclusion to his story."

"And I just felt like it was time to give someone else a turn – if you want to carry on learning you’ve got to take the plunge. Sally Wainwright is writing a third series of Happy Valley and I’m starting to venture into film, so it feels like the right time to challenge myself. I fancy an adventure – I’d love to spend a bit more time in New York or LA, I’m open to opportunities."

I felt sad when he chose to stay with the Church, especially for Amanda (his true love), who had waited so long for him. However, his calling and vocation were stronger.

So, two years later, in season four when Sidney suddenly fell in love with Violet and decided to give up everything for her and to leave his congregation behind for America, it was a great shock to many of his fans.

They had thought that the actor might have changed his mind and stay or at worse that he'd be killed off by the culprit whose crime he was investigating.

The writer thought otherwise and decided to send Sidney off with his new love. Most of his fans were placated with the - though slim - possibility that he might return, perhaps in guest appearances.

I was disappointed as this was completely out of character and belied the choice he had made after the emotional turmoil he went through, struggling between his love for Amanda and his love for God in the past three seasons.

Oh well, he has his happy ending.

Thanks for the James Norton departure info, brat and wonder.

@wonder, Sidney's exit storyline was when I arrived to the series. I agree with the series' fans of from the get-go who felt that his spontaneous romance with Violet, then pretty much spur on the moment decision to up and relocate to the U.S., felt thoroughly made-for-t.v., forced, and entirely unbelievable (not to mention was much too unimaginatively convenient of a way to write him out of the series) - even to me a brand-new viewer at the time.

As I wasn't a viewer of the series prior to Season 4, a question: I've seen Amanda's name occasionally mentioned in TMDb threads. Did the series ever disclose what became of her character after Sidney opted out of spending the rest of his life with her? I mean, did she go away somewhere, never to (so far) be seen again, or is she still supposedly (or perhaps) somewhere in/around Grantchester?

I'm thankful Robson Green wasn't the one to leave! To me Geordie, more than any other, is the central character of the show (it IS, ostensibly at least, a whodunit and he IS the cop after all) especially since the clergymen's personal problems and conflicts are such major plot points, making them unpredictable and unreliable. Not that he's perfect but Geordie has so far (aside from the brief adulterous lapse!) been more level-headed in comparison. His wry/cynical POV keeps matters grounded. It was unsettling when I first read that James Norton was leaving the show but by the time of his last appearance I was relieved he was gone! IMO Will's been a worthy replacement and is a sufficiently messed-up match for Sidney -- sorry bratface!

@genplant29 said: As I wasn't a viewer of the series prior to Season 4, a question: I've seen Amanda's name occasionally mentioned in TMDb threads. Did the series ever disclose what became of her character after Sidney opted out of spending the rest of his life with her? I mean, did she go away somewhere, never to (so far) be seen again, or is she still supposedly (or perhaps) somewhere in/around Grantchester?

It was so weird this past Sunday when I checked the Spectrum channel guide and Morven Christie's name (the actress who played Amanda) appeared in the credits! I was anxious to see the episode and find out why she was back, etc., and was disappointed it turned out to be a mistake. To answer your question genplant, her story line didn't get any kind of a follow-up or resolution as far as I remember, but just ended when Sidney decided he couldn't give up his vocation for her, since marrying a divorced woman was a no-no.

Do any of us think Will and Ellie will ultimately wind up working out as a long-term couple? I'm on the fence regarding whether they stand a chance - though suspect the writers are going to try to make it happen (which, if so, I'm onboard with).

Btw, when Ellie went up to Will's room with him and closed the door, I really expected Mrs. C to come knocking on the door, with some excuse of, "Here's a tray of biscuits and some tea," or something - for propriety's sake, to ensure that door would remain open!

I wouldn't bet on it genplant! At least not until every drop of angst has been milked from their relationship, the way Sidney's and Amanda's was. Ellie is so determined and ambitious about her career in journalism, which seems to border on the tabloid-esque, that I suspect it could play out as an impediment.

Good point about Mrs. C, as she likely wouldn't have approved of ANY woman being in Will's room with the door closed. Was Ellie's visit in the evening? I can't remember, but if so, maybe Mrs. C had gone home for the night. Or is she living at the vicarage now? Or did her husband Jack move out of their house??? But if she's living at the vicarage would there be enough room for Leonard's father, who's coming to stay? I feel like the grandpa in Moonstruck -- I'M CONFUSED!!