@Drooch whatever, the point remains that it's in the future and that's why no one cares. But I do like your comment that it seems like Jackman and Mangold almost seemed like they were single handedly trying to end the X-Men franchise. I hope it does end the franchise so they can start over.

I don't think they want to shut down the whole franchise, just the Jackman-Stewart branch. Jackman wants to wrap it up (he's getting old) and the studio don't want to keep paying these A-listers when you can have cheaper actors playing X-mutants.

I seriously cannot believe that people are actually comparing what happened with Aliens/Alien 3 to Logan... seriously, the scenarios aren't even remotely the same!?!

Context is key people!

I seriously cannot believe that people are actually comparing what happened with Aliens/Alien 3 to Logan... seriously, the scenarios aren't even remotely the same!?!

Context is key people!

In the context of these shared events, they are the same - killing off everyone before the opening credits. Other than our hero, there's only one other major survivor (Xavier, Bishop) who dies in the middle of the film, and finally our hero dies in an act of self-sacrifice.

@Drooch said:

I seriously cannot believe that people are actually comparing what happened with Aliens/Alien 3 to Logan... seriously, the scenarios aren't even remotely the same!?!

Context is key people!

In the context of these shared events, they are the same - killing off everyone before the opening credits. Other than our hero, there's only one other major survivor (Xavier, Bishop) who dies in the middle of the film, and finally our hero dies in an act of self-sacrifice.

But the way it's done is completely different, Alien 3 follows on directly from Aliens and kills off the characters that we saw fight to survive and grew to love throughout the movie with a cheap throw away bit of dialogue as a simple way to get rid of them so they could tell the story that they wanted.

Logan is set years in the future, it was made very clear in the marketing that he was on the run and that mutants were in hiding. We have no idea who was killed during the Westchester event, we can only speculate. All we know is that the incident caused Xavier to be classed as a WMD and is the reason he and Logan are on the run/in hiding. Unlike Alien 3, there is scope for another movie to be made that deals with the Westchester incident and its aftermath.

Other than dying, Bishop and Xavier's character have nothing in common and their relationship with Ripley and Logan are worlds apart.

Heroes have been sacrificing themselves in stories since the beginning of storytelling, their deaths aren't the same!

Just because we have 2 movies where a couple of key characters die, it doesn't mean that they are comparable! The context of why and how they died is key when comparing and when looking at it like that then it's clear that these movies have very little in common.

None of those nit-picky details detract from the striking similarities I mentioned.

@Drooch said:

None of those nit-picky details detract from the striking similarities I mentioned.

Dry your tears. You got corrected, that's all, it's OK.

@Drooch said:

Dry your tears. You got corrected, that's all, it's OK.

stop... you're killing me

@Drooch said:

(Spoilers)

Logan made the same controversial move that Alien 3 did - killing off everyone before the opening credits. Other than our hero, there's only one other major survivor (Xavier, Bishop) who dies in the middle of the film, and finally our hero dies in an act of self-sacrifice.

I can't forgive Alien 3 for doing this to Aliens, and consequently don't see it as canon, but I'm not as invested in the X-Men universe so I'm more willing to be forgiving, but it does seem to be something of a waste to arbitrarily kill off everyone. Didn't X-3 get unlimited hate for killing off a few major characters? Why no hate for this movie for being even more kill-ey?

You should give the Alien 3 Special Edition a go, on the bluray. Its a much improved film.

You should give the Alien 3 Special Edition a go, on the bluray. Its a much improved film.

Oh that's the only version I watch, and I consider it the definitive version of Alien 3. I really like the film but after much deliberation, I don't consider it a legitimate instalment of the Alien story (all those made after Alien 3 are, obviously, not canon either, because they're shít). I can't get past the decision to wipe out all of the characters we loved from Aliens, in whose futures we had invested. It wasn't an artistic decision, it was born of studio madness and star egomania.

The series ended with Ripley and her new family - Hubby Hicks, Newt Kid and crazy Uncle Bishop hyper-sleeping in the Sulaco, and Alien 3 is a weird nightmare, to be broken only by another legitimate Alien film (possibly Blomkamp's proposed Aliens sequel..?)

stop... you're killing me

No, just correcting your mistake.

@Drooch said:

You should give the Alien 3 Special Edition a go, on the bluray. Its a much improved film.

Oh that's the only version I watch, and I consider it the definitive version of Alien 3. I really like the film but after much deliberation, I don't consider it a legitimate instalment of the Alien story (all those made after Alien 3 are, obviously, not canon either, because they're shít). I can't get past the decision to wipe out all of the characters we loved from Aliens, in whose futures we had invested. It wasn't an artistic decision, it was born of studio madness and star egomania.

The series ended with Ripley and her new family - Hubby Hicks, Newt Kid and crazy Uncle Bishop hyper-sleeping in the Sulaco, and Alien 3 is a weird nightmare, to be broken only by another legitimate Alien film (possibly Blomkamp's proposed Aliens sequel..?)

You could try to imagine Alien 3 happening in their heads while sleeping in the Sulaco. The film does have a good dreamlike, nightmarish look. So it didn't happen, for real.

@Drooch said:

You should give the Alien 3 Special Edition a go, on the bluray. Its a much improved film.

Oh that's the only version I watch, and I consider it the definitive version of Alien 3. I really like the film but after much deliberation, I don't consider it a legitimate instalment of the Alien story (all those made after Alien 3 are, obviously, not canon either, because they're shít). I can't get past the decision to wipe out all of the characters we loved from Aliens, in whose futures we had invested. It wasn't an artistic decision, it was born of studio madness and star egomania.

The series ended with Ripley and her new family - Hubby Hicks, Newt Kid and crazy Uncle Bishop hyper-sleeping in the Sulaco, and Alien 3 is a weird nightmare, to be broken only by another legitimate Alien film (possibly Blomkamp's proposed Aliens sequel..?)

You could try to imagine Alien 3 happening in their heads while sleeping in the Sulaco. The film does have a good dreamlike, nightmarish look. So it didn't happen, for real.

The series ended with Ripley and her new family - Hubby Hicks, Newt Kid and crazy Uncle Bishop hyper-sleeping in the Sulaco, and Alien 3 is a weird nightmare, to be broken only by another legitimate Alien film (possibly Blomkamp's proposed Aliens sequel..?)

You could try to imagine Alien 3 happening in their heads while sleeping in the Sulaco. The film does have a good dreamlike, nightmarish look. So it didn't happen, for real.

Hence why I referred to it as 'a weird nightmare' above.

@Drooch said:

The series ended with Ripley and her new family - Hubby Hicks, Newt Kid and crazy Uncle Bishop hyper-sleeping in the Sulaco, and Alien 3 is a weird nightmare, to be broken only by another legitimate Alien film (possibly Blomkamp's proposed Aliens sequel..?)

You could try to imagine Alien 3 happening in their heads while sleeping in the Sulaco. The film does have a good dreamlike, nightmarish look. So it didn't happen, for real.

Hence why I referred to it as 'a weird nightmare' above.

And isn't it much better to see Ali3n in that light. I think so anyway. The film stands apart nicely from Alien and Aliens as a decent film, the special edition version anyway!

Alien Resurrection is where things turn dreadful for me. That film makes Alien 3 look like a timeless classic, thats how bad that film is. The Predator spinoff, dreadful and worse. Barely could watch it, and the sequel to that, didn't watch it. Won't!