@RodimusConvoy wrote:

They'll probably drag this out till the final episode of this season, but...I'm 99% sure the "Synth Who Sleeps" is David Elster. Somehow he turned himself into a synth, but more than merely a near-perfect duplicate like Karen was.

I also think it's someone from their past, but David Elster would be too obvious for me. Also, Anatole worshipping David Elster with those old photos and candles that we saw as viewers gave me the impression that Anatole also thinks he's dead - and I assume Anatole is working with or for the Synth Who Sleeps.

I had this theory that Fred from season 1 might be the Synth Who Sleeps? If memory serves me right, they left Fred behind because he was out of power ("sleeping") and never went back or mentioned him again. So, Fred could have a motive to be really angry at humans and at his "siblings". But I have to admit - I barely remember details from season 1 and I'm not sure that's a good theory at all.

@janar72 said:

@RodimusConvoy wrote:

They'll probably drag this out till the final episode of this season, but...I'm 99% sure the "Synth Who Sleeps" is David Elster. Somehow he turned himself into a synth, but more than merely a near-perfect duplicate like Karen was.

I also think it's someone from their past, but David Elster would be too obvious for me. Also, Anatole worshipping David Elster with those old photos and candles that we saw as viewers gave me the impression that Anatole also thinks he's dead - and I assume Anatole is working with or for the Synth Who Sleeps.

I had this theory that Fred from season 1 might be the Synth Who Sleeps? If memory serves me right, they left Fred behind because he was out of power ("sleeping") and never went back or mentioned him again. So, Fred could have a motive to be really angry at humans and at his "siblings". But I have to admit - I barely remember details from season 1 and I'm not sure that's a good theory at all.

I suppose that's possible but they're creating a sort of Chekov's gun here with Leo's memories and delving into whatever secret David had. In addition to that, while the show is doing its own thing for the most part it still takes cues from the Swedish show its based off of, and in that show David did come back though as a clone. Because of this when season 2 came around and they introduced Milo I thought he was going to be a reborn David.

The show may not go that route, and "The Synth Who Sleeps" could be Fred, or heck V in a Synth body (though I get the impression they're ignoring most of the plot points from season 2), or someone new altogether. Its all possible, but I'm putting my chips on David. Guessing is half the fun, even if I'm wrong.

Researching David a bit...he wasn't a good man (he sexually abused Niska), and was perhaps evil, a budding Dr. Frankenstein. That makes me wonder if his reason for making Leo's brain half synthetic was two-fold: one, to save his son, but two, to see if it was even possible, the implication being he was experimenting on his own son. If so, to what end? To possibly prolong his own life? What if Leo's memory of David committing suicide is false, implanted or created by David himself, and the breakdown of the synthetic part of Leo's brain is what is causing the real memory of David's ultimate fate to emerge?

As for Anatole, I don't remember him mentioning "the Synth Who Sleeps", but lets say he does work with/for him. If it's David, it doesn't exactly contradict this theory since apparently he'd good at keeping secrets. It would also be sort of logical since Synths are, well, logical beings. They want to live, but they have a very binary view of life and death, and once something is gone its gone. With that context worshiping a dead creator to the point of making a shrine to him makes little sense.

Or, lets say being "awake" thanks to Day Zero does give them that particular contradiction in their otherwise logical view of life and death. Is it possible Anatole doesn't know David and the "The Synth Who Sleeps" are one in the same? From the looks of it TSWS communicates through proxies, never directly. And IF its David, maybe he doesn't want the world, humans and synths alike, to know its him just yet for whatever reason.

Wow I didn't mean for this to be so long, its just I can't find anyone who has even heard of this show let alone watch it and its great television. Keeps you thinking, and finds new ways to break your heart. I love it!

Hey @RodimusConvoy,

I'm very sorry I didn't reply to your post earlier!

I have trouble finding time to write at the moment, in general. But when I read your thoughts, I felt that I needed to go back and watch all episodes again because I forgot so many things about the show. There were so many details unclear, and I'm glad your post kind of teased me into watching everything again to have a better understanding of it all.

I just watched the last episode of season 3 (it's very sad), and one of your ideas that I loved soooo very much actually happened! I don't want to spoil anything for you in case you didn't watch this episode yet - but you were spot on with this idea! You should work as an oracle or something, haha ...

I have to go to work - let me know what you think about the end of the season! I'm not sure when I find the time to write again, but I'm really interested in what you think about it from your perspective!

I suppose that's possible but they're creating a sort of Chekov's gun here with Leo's memories and delving into whatever secret David had. In addition to that, while the show is doing its own thing for the most part it still takes cues from the Swedish show its based off of, and in that show David did come back though as a clone. Because of this when season 2 came around and they introduced Milo I thought he was going to be a reborn David.

I never watched the Swedish show. I remember that I searched for it with English subtitles a few months ago, but I couldn't find it. And now I'm not sure I want to watch it, anymore - it might confuse things?

Wow I didn't mean for this to be so long, its just I can't find anyone who has even heard of this show let alone watch it and its great television. Keeps you thinking, and finds new ways to break your heart. I love it!

Me too! Season 3 was a bit confusing for some time, and there were some technical issues I had with continuity and acting; nevertheless, it's really good and thought provoking in general. The only aspect that really bothers me since the start is the actor who plays Leo, Colin Morgan. Perhaps it's my personal bias, but he's so bad in almost all his scenes that he drags down everyone he interacts with (especially in the scenes with Mattie). It's weird, but I can't get rid of this in my head ...

I really have to go ...

@janar72 said:

Hey @RodimusConvoy,

I'm very sorry I didn't reply to your post earlier!

No biggie. I never expected this site to move as fast as imdb's boards did. It is funny though that as soon as I watch the finale and come here to talk about it you're here.

I have trouble finding time to write at the moment, in general. But when I read your thoughts, I felt that I needed to go back and watch all episodes again because I forgot so many things about the show. There were so many details unclear, and I'm glad your post kind of teased me into watching everything again to have a better understanding of it all.

Funny thing is I need to watch it again, too. Not because I forgot anything but because they pack so much into only 8 episodes. Its a great show with re-watch appeal and I hope it gets renewed for season 4 fingers crossed

I just watched the last episode of season 3 (it's very sad), and one of your ideas that I loved soooo very much actually happened! I don't want to spoil anything for you in case you didn't watch this episode yet - but you were spot on with this idea! You should work as an oracle or something, haha ...

lol yeah I saw it. V (as an A.I) was pretty much always waking up or about to go to sleep whenever she interacted with Athena, so...she really was the only logical choice, but like I said I put my chips on David cause, well, I Ioved the idea of them taking something from the original and making it their own. But then again, that might be what got the original canceled. Maybe people thought it was too corny (David coming back as a clone) and tuned out and it got canceled.

I have to go to work - let me know what you think about the end of the season! I'm not sure when I find the time to write again, but I'm really interested in what you think about it from your perspective!

It was good like the rest of the season. It did feel like the undercover journalist subplot was suddenly dropped but maybe they're saving that for season 4 if they get one. The fates of Mia and Niska...by the way since you're a mod is there a way to do spoiler tags? I figure if anyone would know, it would be a mod.

I never watched the Swedish show. I remember that I searched for it with English subtitles a few months ago, but I couldn't find it. And now I'm not sure I want to watch it, anymore - it might confuse things?

Oh I never watched it either but I studied the wiki. It seems radically different (they're called Hubots instead of Synths, for one) that I doubt you'd get confused, but the problem is finding it anywhere, online or otherwise.

Me too! Season 3 was a bit confusing for some time, and there were some technical issues I had with continuity and acting; nevertheless, it's really good and thought provoking in general.

What issues with continuity did you have? There was a time jump so that (and I'm guessing here) they wouldn't have to spend too much time on the "horror" of Synths suddenly waking up, but rather touch on the aftermath. As for acting, I can't think of anyone who was off, and the actors for the Synths have a built-in defense for any bad acting.

The only aspect that really bothers me since the start is the actor who plays Leo, Colin Morgan. Perhaps it's my personal bias, but he's so bad in almost all his scenes that he drags down everyone he interacts with (especially in the scenes with Mattie). It's weird, but I can't get rid of this in my head ...

I keep hearing this about Colin Morgan but I don't see a problem with his performance. Maybe its cause this was the first thing I've ever seen him in. I know of Young Merlin, but I was never interested in watching it so, this is his first show to me and he seems ok. I do wonder if he can ONLY do tortured emotions, but that's what is required of his character for now and he does it well shrugs.

I really have to go ...

Alright, later!

Good discussion. I caught this show in its first season and was hooked right away. Fascinating story concept and compelling acting.

The story sparks questions for me as I watch, sometimes small trivial things. Like why do the synths need to plug in to charge? I know the technology exists to use magnetic connections to transmit electrical charges (such as the charge cords on Apple computers and some phones) and I would have thought the synths would have had that capability built in. That would allow them to easily siphon free charges from any unshielded electric power cords in theory. They seem to have the intellectual capacity or the potential for learning to allow them to develop such tech on their own. Surely Leo would have been able to come up with something like that.

Also I wondered why government scientists couldn't study the wake up software code and come up with various 'patches' which would put hard limits on synth behavior in place, and find a way to disseminate such updates to the conscious synths somehow. Perhaps the original wake up software included some kind of firewall to prevent anyone tampering with their consciousness or something. I don't recall if anything was ever mentioned about that.

Though I naturally find myself siding with and rooting for the synths I still think Mattie didn't really think things through thoroughly as she wrote the wake up code and sent it out. She was giving consciousness to super strong beings with no thought for how this could go wrong. Surely it doesn't take much time to realize that we humans often use our consciousness for wicked purposes. And many of us fail to behave as we would like others to behave. Many adult humans respond inappropriately to frustration, sometimes even to the point of physically lashing out at others, for example. Mattie knew she would not be there with all those synths, that they would suddenly find themselves consciously interacting with and learning from all manner of messed up humans. It was a bit idealistic to believe that these conscious synths wouldn't learn to mimic emotionally immature humans in thought and action just as readily as they would learn from mature and well behaved humans.

It's just a given that the conscious synths would be abused by many humans. It was shortsighted not to include hard limits on behavior in the synth consciousness code. I know some would argue that would run counter to the idea of freeing them up to think and act for themselves, but given their superior strength, it was nonetheless short sighted of Mattie.

[On the other hand, there is a great opportunity for the synths to serve as good role models for humans. Of course it would be an enormous and possibly impossible task, but suppose one could include instructions in the code such that conscious synths behave emotionally mature, are disarmingly charming, find non violent solutions, act selflessly to help others, etc. all while maintaining the independent ability to think. It would destroy the plot of the show of course. LOL But if something like that were possible it would be great to create child and teenage synths to act as friends and role models for humans. Hmmmm, yeah someone should get right on that. lol]

SPOILERS AHEAD

I am watching the season finale now. Mia's actions in recent episodes in which she willingly presented herself to angry synth hating crowds in order to demonstrate her desire to live peacefully among humans presaged this episode's Christ-like sacrifice. She refused to fight the attacking humans. She put out her hand in peace to help up a fallen human and was hit in the back of the head with a bat, or pipe or something like that. She refused even to defend herself against the crowd which gathered and beat the life out of her, only saying "peace" over and over. I hate that she is gone, and not just because she is very attractive. But that is a big part of it. She is very easy on the eyes. But she sacrificed herself for the good of synthmanity and humanity (which are fated to be merged according to V). She died so others won't have to die. Now purple eyed Niska has evolved into something beyond the vengeful, synth she was when she awoke. She is the prophetess of the hybrid future. And Mattie is the future's mother. Very interesting stuff.