Why does it have to be normalized in the first place? The common goal here has to be where we can watch a movie or a TV show and not react, flinch, or give a damn that there is a gay married couple on screen. Not everyone is liberal or open-minded, for some it takes longer. From what I read, you don't sound so ok with it either? And please don't use "we" and refer to us viewers in general. Sorry, but you don't get to speak for me.

Maybe it'll take a backseat when the trans-agenda goes full steam ahead.

@diadara said:

The common goal here has to be where **we** can watch a movie or a TV show 
```and not react, flinch, or give a damn that there is a gay married couple on screNot everyone is liberal or open-minded, for some it takes longer. From what I read, you don't sound so ok with it either? And please don't use "we" and refer to us viewers in general. Sorry, but you don't get to speak for me.en. 

Please don't use "we" and refer to us viewers in general. You don't get to speak for others either. See how that works?

@YouMightRabbitYouMight said:

@diadara said:

The common goal here has to be where **we** can watch a movie or a TV show 
```and not react, flinch, or give a damn that there is a gay married couple on screNot everyone is liberal or open-minded, for some it takes longer. From what I read, you don't sound so ok with it either? And please don't use "we" and refer to us viewers in general. Sorry, but you don't get to speak for me.en. 

Please don't use "we" and refer to us viewers in general. You don't get to speak for others either. See how that works?

Well then I apologize. In my references to "we" I meant the entire human race. You referenced this show's viewers. If you don't want to be a part of a world where your friends should have the same right to appear in a movie without being "shoehorned in" as you put it, then that's a damn shame. I'm afraid you're going to have to live with it.

Being gay is not a label. Neither is being straight or bi. One day maybe the world can see two men or two women get married and say "what a lovely couple", and not give a second thought about their gender.

Gee. Tell me more about myself. I always like being psychoanalyzed by strangers on the internet. This is a fascinating experience. Too bad you don't have any skills to validate your incorrect assessments. Made clear by the fact that I never said anything remotely close to my friends not having the same rights as myself, though you try to twist and manipulate my post to appear that way. I'm talking about the writing here. It's sloppy and forced. Anyone with a set of eyes can see that.

You my dear are the one who decided to make this about the posters and not the post. So I would suggest you shine some of that self-righteous light on yourself. Though you may see some things you don't like.

@YouMightRabbitYouMight said:

Gee. Tell me more about myself. I always like being psychoanalyzed by strangers on the internet. This is a fascinating experience. Too bad you don't have any skills to validate your incorrect assessments. Made clear by the fact that I never said anything remotely close to my friends not having the same rights as myself, though you try to twist and manipulate my post to appear that way. I'm talking about the writing here. It's sloppy and forced. Anyone with a set of eyes can see that.

You my dear are the one who decided to make this about the posters and not the post. So I would suggest you shine some of that self-righteous light on yourself. Though you may see some things you don't like.

Again, my apologies. English is not my first language. I am many things but self righteous is not one of them, on the contrary, I am well known amongst my peers to fight the good fight. However one of my flaws lies in when and where to pick the fights. I see so much hate every day and I've lived with it in our family for so long that it's hard not to speak up when equal rights are being questioned. I have one voice, and if I can put it out there I will.

I see now that I have offended you, that wasn't my intention, but as I see it you should tell your friends that they are wrong. People are not PC props in movies.

@diadara said:

People are not PC props in movies.

I agree. People are not props. My issue is that I feel that's exactly what they did on Salvation the other night. To me, the entire scene of the SOD leaving, and then stopping to give us a story about how much he loves his husband, and then showing the husband, felt forced. Why? Because prior to that there was never any reference to him, and that entire scene felt like it was inserted because the writers decided "Let's take this opportunity to show a happy gay couple that is at the highest levels of government."

It would have been much better writing had they just made Darian Tanz gay, and have Lazlo been his partner. But then they wouldn't be able to have the sexual tension between him and Grace. Also, you'd lose the triangle scenario of Darian/Grace/Harris. Instead, we get this heavy-handed bit of writing. Please understand, recognizing forced and sloppy writing does not have anything to do with my outlook on gay marriage, which I support. And it's not like we have our 'gay friend'. We have many gay friends and gay couples in our life. Earlier in my OP, I used the term "I have a couple of gay friends" because only 2 were my friends, and the others I've met via my wife. I think if you do take a close look at TV these days, nearly every show has a gay character. Not that there's anything wrong with that. But it's clearly being pushed and is disproportionate. Hollywood themselves admits they are doing it. Much the same way they pushed the culture with black actors and minority characters and shows starting in the late 60's and 70's. This was also done with women. They did that in a deliberate disproportionate fashion so as to make it 'normal' on the TV screens, so it would feel normal to the viewers in their daily lives.

Curerntly, it's a gay agenda being pushed. Want another example? Making Sulu gay in the Star Trek films. The original actor who played Sulu didn't even like that. Why? Because it was forced. It was bad writing and character development, done only to make him gay. George Takei stated "I Think It's Really Unfortunate". The writers actually called him to 'give him the great news' that Sulu was now gay. Here's some from an article on this...

_"Except Takei wasn't overjoyed. He had never asked for Sulu to be gay. In fact, he'd much prefer that he stay straight. "I’m delighted that there’s a gay character," he tells The Hollywood Reporter. "Unfortunately, it’s a twisting of Gene’s creation, to which he put in so much thought. I think it’s really unfortunate. I really tried to work with these people when at long last the issue of gay equality was going to be addressed..."

Takei explains that Roddenberry was exhaustive in conceiving his Star Trek characters. (The name Sulu, for example, was based on the Sulu Sea off the coast of the Philippines, so as to render his Asian nationality indeterminate.) And Roddenberry had always envisioned Sulu as heterosexual._

I don't like agenda's being pushed in TV or films. But if it has to be, can't it be done elegantly, and not forced into the plot or story simply to make a point, and done in an awkward fashion at that?

@YouMightRabbitYouMight said:

I don't like agenda's being pushed in TV or films. But if it has to be, can't it be done elegantly, and not forced into the plot or story simply to make a point, and done in an awkward fashion at that?

Point at anything and I will tell you its agenda because that's how it is nowadays. It's becoming quite blasé if you ask me. The thing about fighting for something and winning is that somewhere further down the road some schmuck is going to spin that win and tear it up again. That my friend is why life is one big game of whack-a-mole.

Ironically, "Gone with the Wind" is now banned from several theaters in the US because of what they call racial insensitivity. I guess they must have spotted a mole.

I think that the Salvation writers panicked because they realized that the world was about to end and they knew that there was no way a gay man or woman was going to be one of the 160 on-board the Ark 😉

"That my friend is why life is one big game of whack-a-mole."
That's a unique way of looking at things. Not how I choose to view life, but hey.

Fighting and winning is fine. But writing doesn't change, and that was, imo, bad, sloppy, forced writing. You may like it. Fair enough. Art is very subjective.

Gone with the Wind being banned is absurd.

@YouMightRabbitYouMight said:

Gee. Tell me more about myself. I always like being psychoanalyzed by strangers on the internet. This is a fascinating experience. Too bad you don't have any skills to validate your incorrect assessments. Made clear by the fact that I never said anything remotely close to my friends not having the same rights as myself, though you try to twist and manipulate my post to appear that way. I'm talking about the writing here. It's sloppy and forced. Anyone with a set of eyes can see that.

You my dear are the one who decided to make this about the posters and not the post. So I would suggest you shine some of that self-righteous light on yourself. Though you may see some things you don't like.

Bravo!

And I totally agree with your OP. That scene was very clumsily handled and felt forced. I've been noticing a lot of that lately in movies and tv. It always makes me cringe and takes me out of the story if it doesn't feel organic.

This whole discussion is pretty gay.

@YouMightRabbitYouMight said:

I have a couple of friends that are gay, but even one of them said the continual shoehorning of gays into stories is beyond forced. But the gay Secretary of Defense giving his "I have a husband I love..." speech takes the cake. It was obviously put into the story line to show the 'normalization' of gay marriage. We get it. Does it need to be in nearly every TV show these days?

haha. typical "I have a couple of friends that are gay, but..." 2 out of the rest of the gay population agree that there is too much LGBT representation in Hollywood now. lol. And they're not even ashamed of themselves.

Are they really your friends? ...Are they? Doesn't matter, because you supported your argument with a non-starter. Caitlyn Jenner was quoted saying trans people shouldn't be trans if they can't be convincing about it. Does she speak for all LGBT people? h@ll no.