Discuss Marvel's The Defenders

so i'm currently on episode 4 of the defenders, and luke and jessica are surprisingly cordial with each other. i was expecting that when they saw each other again, luke would at the very least be giving her the evil eye throughout. after all, she did kill his wife and hide that fact all while she was having sex with him. as i recall the last thing he said to her (in jessica jones) was that she was a "piece of shit". then he "forgave" her when he was under kilgrave's mind control. have i missed a scene where luke genuinely forgave her? could anyone ever have forgiveness for someone that killed their wife and lied about it, as well as sexually exploiting them?? or is this very, very sloppy writing? hmmm.

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Well, you can't distance them too far apart. They do end up getting married (in the comics). So I'm sure that a direction they want to keep open.

I think given time and distance (and a bunch of foundation-rattling sex with Claire Temple/Night Nurse) he's probably put it behind him somewhat.

The wounds aren't as fresh, he still clearly finds her attractive (lots of lingering glances in the Defenders), and he probably has a better understanding of the psychological damage Kilgrave did to her since he was also mind-controlled into trying to kill her and whatnot. She slept with him without telling him about her involvement with his wife's death (even if she's innocent of the murder) - which was very s****y - but she's obviously a depressed alcoholic, and Luke is the kind of man who I think would tend towards grey thinking (as opposed to black and white). It'll be interesting to see how his relationship with Claire develops in LC2 - and see if the Netflix series goes fully against the comics (where LC and JJ are soooo endgame).

i think what she did was beyond s****y. i feel surprisingly strongly about this even though it is a tv show, i guess because there are some parallels in real life. i'm certain that if the genders were reversed, and it was luke who had killed jessica's husband , then formed a sexual relationship with a grieving jessica, and not only failed to tell her of his involvement, but actively tried to cover it up, it would be all over social media and in articles describing how jessica had been sexually abused and emotionally exploited by luke. which would be true. the reason why i can say that with confidence is because something very similar happened in real life here in the uk, when a number of undercover police infiltrated some anarchist groups, formed relationships with the women, even fathering children with them. now those coppers would say they were doing what was required to gather intelligence and fight crime, (just as as jessica could cite her trauma as justification for her actions), but the women involved felt utterly violated. they will never forgive those men for what they did. my argument is that if the genders were reversed in the luke and jessica storyline, the idea that jessica would not only forgive luke, but then flirt with him and - if the tv show follows the comics, marry him and have a child - there would be a huge backlash, i.e. the writers are airbrushing out and underplaying luke's abusive and predatory behaviour. to my mind, there is a form of sexism at work here, where males being sexually exploited and manipulated by females is somehow less egregious. again we see this played out in real life, for example when the media cover stories of teachers having sex with pupils.

as for jessica's actions, yes she was violated in the most profound way, her ability to choose was taken, and kilgrave raped her physically many times, but the decision to lie to luke and try to cover up her involvement was her choice. no kilgrave involved there. i would have preferred that this storyline was never written into the show in the first place, as having luke and jessica get together after all this is problematic and far fetched.

tbh i have not read jessica in depth, i have her alias comic on my to read list, but from i have read of her in the new avengers and other stuff, she is very different from this tv version. comic jessica seems to have a bit more fight in her, and would not accept that her lot in life after being abused by kilgrave was to remain a depressed hostile alcoholic. i work in the mental health field, and every day i see people that are broken, but they want some form of recovery, whatever that means for them. why can't we see a storyline like that come through in jessica jones? i hope that soon, the writers show jessica working towards living her life, rather than just surviving it.

wow. that was quite an essay! too long but please read.

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