Discuss Star Trek: Enterprise

The teacher assumed, and Archer didn't correct her, that the following 250 years on Earth after they left, were just peaceful progress. But they probably missed the Civil War, and definitely missed WW I, WW II, and WW III/Eugenics Wars etc. THAT is where most of the technological progress came from, that resulted in a Warp 5 starship. Seen in that context, their "backwards" planet might not have been so bad.

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Well considering that no new humans were brought to there,one could come to the several conclusions ;

a) they got moral and ethical objections to the whole kidnapping thing so they stopped it

b) it was no longer profitable or it had served it's purpose

c) the alien civilization fell into decline be it to wars or natural disasters,and lost the ability of faster than light travel

Those are some explanations. There are others. They may have never planned to follow up on the startup colonies to begin with, they were just plant-and-leave operations, assuming the colony would make contact with THEM if they succeeded. They might have wound up at the wrong planet so the original aliens didn't know where to look. (I for one can believe that they didn't PLAN TO colonize such a barren world as we saw it.) There might have been some kind of problem with the ship, especially if some of the "passengers" caused trouble along the way.

But why and where would they get more humans Earth seems a no no since Earth has joined the rest of the space faring civilizations and is probably looked after by the Vulcans also that alien civilization also has evolved over the past 250 years (look how far mankind has evolved)So even if it has not evolved morally they would have evolved technologically so who is not to say that going to get some justice there would amount to getting your starship blown to pieces?

Maybe. Unless they're like the Pakleds or something. Somewhat able to use technology obtained from others, but incapable of producing their own.

Another possibility is that, while looking for sturdier workers for another colony, they took some Klingons and the Klingons blew up their planet in return.

Why do you seem to be hellbent on getting even with those aliens?he Romans tried that approach on their northern border along the Rhine fighting the Germans for four centuries look how that turned out.

They need to track down the aliens and make sure they aren't kidnapping others any more. Like they should have gone back to the aliens they stole the warp coil from, and made sure they got home safely. But that whole bit was really just Because Plot to start with. The warp coil wasn't so big that either ship couldn't have been carrying multiple spares. It was just a "device" to make Archer be unhappy with what he did.

Well who says that didn't happen you should ask yourself is it worth an entire episode for them to go looking for that ship returning their warp coil and apologize to it's crew?It's a TV show not a real life soap.But what I do understand from your words is that you would support the black part of the US population if they would go after those responsible for kidnapping them from Africa and using them as slaves for over 200 years making sure it never happens again?

Slavery is a whole lot more complicated for various reasons, which I hope you know. Where they should start, if that actually happened, is that ONLY descendants of ACTUAL SLAVES - which means no recent immigrants from Costa Rica, etc - go back to Africa and deal with the other black people who captured and sold them/their ancestors. Many/most of whom were muslim, by the way. (And some muslims in Africa still have slavery to this day.) Now, we both know - or at least I do - that's never going to happen. And so the whole chain (so to speak) falls apart right there.

The more important issue, of course, is that it was never even mentioned again. And you can't say that Starfleet sent some other starship out to do it, because THERE WEREN'T ANY OTHERS! Up to NX-01, we're shown all they had were cargo/colony ships, which didn't even make Warp 2. In addition to having very limited weapons if they were needed.

It would have taken maybe 5 seconds to mention that Archer got one of the Xindi Aquatic ships to go pick them up and take them home, in "less than a day" as was said about Enterprise too.

It would also have taken no extra time at all, for Reed to drop a piece of the Xindi weapon into Tucker's/Trip's hand, as he had said he would before they left.

Here is something from Thomas Sowell that you might find useful. (and Sowell is black, so by today's rules you can't disagree with him, because that would automatically make you racist. grinning )

Thomas Sowell: Poisoning present by distorting slavery's past

Many years ago, I was surprised to receive a letter from an old friend, saying she had been told I refused to see campus visitors from Africa.

At the time, I was so bogged down with work that I had agreed to see only one visitor to the Stanford campus - and it so happens he was from Africa. He just happened to come along when I had a little breathing room from the work I was doing in my office.

I pointed out to my friend that whoever said what she heard might just as well have said that I refused to go sky-diving with blacks - which was true, because I refused to go sky-diving with anybody, whether black, white, Asian or whatever.

The kind of thinking that produced a passing misconception about me has, unfortunately, produced much bigger, much longer lasting, much more systematic and more poisonous distortions about the United States of America.

Slavery is a classic example. The history of slavery across the centuries and in many countries around the world is a painful history to read - not only in terms of how slaves have been treated, but because of what that says about the whole human species - because slaves and enslavers alike have been of every race, religion and nationality.

If the history of slavery ought to teach us anything, it is that human beings cannot be trusted with unbridled power over other human beings - no matter what color or creed any of them are. The history of ancient despotism and modern totalitarianism practically shouts that same message from the blood-stained pages of history.

But that is not the message that is being taught in our schools and colleges, or dramatized on television and in the movies. The message pounded home again and again is that white people enslaved black people.

It is true, just as it is true that I don't go sky-diving with blacks. But it is also false in its implications for the same reason. Just as Europeans enslaved Africans, North Africans enslaved Europeans; more Europeans than there were Africans enslaved in the United States and in the 13 colonies from which it was formed.

The treatment of white galley slaves was even worse than the treatment of black slaves picking cotton. But there are no movies or television dramas about it comparable to Roots, and our schools and colleges don't pound it into the heads of students.

The inhumanity of human beings toward other human beings is not a new story, much less a local story. There is no need to hide it, because there are lessons we can learn from it. But there is also no need to distort it, so that sins of the whole human species around the world are presented as special defects of "our society" or the sins of a particular race.

If American society and Western civilization are different from other societies and civilization, it is that they eventually turned against slavery, and stamped it out, at a time when non-Western societies around the world were still maintaining slavery and resisting Western pressures to end slavery, including in some cases armed resistance.

Only the fact that the West had more firepower than others put an end to slavery in many non-Western societies during the age of Western imperialism. Yet today there are Americans who have gone to Africa to apologize for slavery - on a continent where slavery has still not been completely ended, to this very moment.

It is not just the history of slavery that gets distorted beyond recognition by the selective filtering of facts. Those who go back to mine history, in order to find everything they can to undermine American society or Western civilization, have very little interest in the Bataan death march, the atrocities of the Ottoman Empire or similar atrocities in other times and places.

Those who mine history for sins are not searching for truth but for opportunities to denigrate their own society, or for grievances that can be cashed in today, at the expense of people who were not even born when the sins of the past were committed.

An ancient adage says: "Sufficient for the day is the evil thereof." But apparently that is not sufficient for many among our educators, the intelligentsia or the media. They are busy poisoning the present by the way they present the past.

Thomas Sowell is a senior fellow at the Hoover Institution. His website is tsowell.com.

As someone who is quite familiar with history and also the usually unknown history I completely agree with Sowell's assertion and that it is often hard to recognize who is wrong or right and who has blame and who has not and like I have expressed in past posts every culture and race have their fair share of dark pages in their history that nobody can claim moral superiority.And that is the point I was trying to make to you about going to the alien's home planet and get some payback,since we humans have our fair share of wrong doings so who are we to judge an alien race who were guilty of the thing which at the time that the kidnappings happened was commonplace on Earthn or not so long prior to that.

Comparing timelines directly like that would be, to quote Spock, "highly illogical." At the time the aliens took the humans to build their colony, slavery still existed ON EARTH (as it still does to this day, in some part especially Muslim parts of Africa), but humans were not a space-faring race at that time. The aliens were. Slavery was abolished on Earth, at least by the more advanced Western countries, long before space travel. Why wouldn't the aliens do the same? And what would be so wrong to expect it of them?

@Knixon said:

At the time the aliens took the humans to build their colony, slavery still existed ON EARTH (as it still does to this day, in some part especially Muslim parts of Africa), but humans were not a space-faring race at that time. The aliens were. Slavery was abolished on Earth, at least by the more advanced Western countries, long before space travel. Why wouldn't the aliens do the same? And what would be so wrong to expect it of them?


Does technolically more advanced go hand in hand with ethically more advanced?

Do slave traders in certain parts of the world not use all the modern technology, which they can easily acquire from the more (technologically and ethically) advanced countries, to use in their (despicable) line of work?

When humans become a spacefaring race, what will prevent certain groups from continuing their slave trade in space?

Space travel, colonizing and building colonies is expensive, and cheap labour, even some kind of slavery - e.g. using prisoners (did you forget to pay your traffic ticket?) - will be accepted, also in the more advanced countries, to save on costs and maximize profits (the shareholders and the taxpayers must be kept content).

Even if slavery is abolished completely on Earth, will that be a universal law, including every living being in the entire known and unknown galaxy? Or does it only apply to the humans from Earth and their descendants, so that aliens can still be used as slaves?

And if all humans in all countries agree to not enslave each other anymore and live happily together in a complete utopian bliss , will they also treat aliens the same way, because they now have the ability to travel through space, meaning that with more knowledge, comes more wisdom, and finally the acceptance and embracing of all sentient creatures?

If this is all possible and humans can do it, then yes, why haven't those spacefaring aliens logically already abolished slavery for everyone, including those not of their own race, species, planet, galaxy, time line, etc.?

The only answer to 'why not', is that humans are and will always be morally superior to those slave trafficking aliens, who have probably bought or stolen the space ship.

In the future when humans venture into space, the aliens will be celebrating, waving flags and throwing parties. They'll be overjoyed to know that they have nothing to fear from spacefaring humans. At least, not when it comes to slavery.

The point I was trying to make is why Knix feels to need for Archer and co to travel to the alien home world to get some payback for kidnapping those Humans when we Humans have been guilty of the same behavior for the largest part of our history we can't claim moral superiority over them just because we abolished slavery since WW III(the last 100 years)and who knows maybe those alien abolished slavery only 50 years after those Humans were kidnapped?

@Nexus71 said:

Well for once History turned the card for the white man being kidnapped from their homes and being used as slaves.

And there was No need to turn the card, plenty of whites were (and in some areas still are) enslaved especially by Muslims in Africa and the Middle East. Or don't you know that's what the US Marine Corps was formed about? "To the shores of Tripoli," etc.

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