write2topcat--

Ha, I never heard that one. I was only five when this film was theatrically released, so I only ever saw it on TV, sometime in the mid-1980s. I recall it used to be shown fairly often.

I have to wonder if that rumor only really got started when the Internet hit its stride in the late 1990s. Until then you had the persistent beliefs in a "flat Earth", and a secret alternate underground Earth, and the belief in a faked Moon landing, etc. etc. But those rumors were only held to be true by a very small number of people; with the advent of the Internet, a patina of reality seems to surround these rumors, with perhaps dozens or more websites dedicated to such beliefs, such that otherwise intelligent people are giving these rumors some serious thought. This is where I think the Internet has made us dumber.

Of greater interest than the rumor you mention, write2topcat, might be a perennial belief even among serious historians, going back probably to not long after World War 2 ended, that President Roosevelt may indeed have known ahead of time about the impending Japanese attack on Pearl Harbor, and still allowed it to happen, such was his frustration that the American people were still in 1941 largely cool to the idea of entering the war while Churchill's Britain was being hammered (not to mention Stalin's USSR). A "sneak attack", so the theory goes, would finally shake America out of its torpor and Roosevelt could finally bring the U.S. into the war directly, putting most of its effort, at least initially, against Germany, who Roosevelt reckoned to be the bigger threat (not Japan).

There is an intriguing final chapter in John Costello's book "The Pacific War" (first published in 1981) where he mentions Allied records finally declassified in 1980, which mention, among other things, a case of an obscure American naval officer-- by the name of Lieutenant Commander Kramer --who inquired, just hours after the attack on Pearl Harbor, if America's code-breaking equipment could be used to TRANSMIT a message back to Japan; the answer was yes, it was possible, but Kramer never gave a message to transmit; after the war an effort was made to locate Kramer for further questions on the subject, only to find out that Lt. Cmdr Kramer had died. The impression of the person giving the testimony (another naval officer) about Kramer was that this mystery message was not Kramer's idea, but that it was coming from somewhere "higher up".

This whole episode would definitely qualify as a case of "truth is stranger than fiction", if there is any truth to it, as compared to the rumor you've mentioned.

In any case, I do remember "The Final Countdown" as being enjoyable Saturday afternoon fare, and I thank you for your post, write2topcat.

That was really just my spur of the moment attempt at silly, fatuous humor. I get that way sometimes.

I am aware of the theory that Roosevelt knew of the attack and allowed it to proceed. I think he would have to have had help in doing that. Anyone involved in such a conspiracy would know to keep their mouths shut or be executed for committing treason by aiding our enemy. While I understand the reasoning behind this theory, that an attack was needed to spur the public to support going to war, I think the theory is a little bit weak. Would Roosevelt believe that only a sneak attack would be sufficient, i.e. would he think the mere fact that we were attacked though able to put up a defense not be enough of a provocation to enrage the public and create support for going to war?

Here is how I think that theory might hold water. Suppose that Roosevelt thought that with our new radar installation on the island that the planes would be detected far enough in advance that the alert would be sounded in time for us to both scramble our interceptor planes and also get ships moving toward open water. In that case he might think that any damage from such an attack might be minimal while still enraging the public sufficiently to support joining the war effort so we could help save our British allies.

Remember that Roosevelt had an extremely difficult time, and it was politically costly to him, just to do the lend lease program to give some aide to the British. Had Hitler been able to choke off the shipping lanes any more than he was able, the Brits would have run out of supplies, food, weapons and ammunition, and the other goods they depend upon and get from trade. After WWI there was no political will in the UK for maintaining any military preparedness, despite loud warnings from Churchill of the approaching danger. So the Brits were in serious need of our aide, and Roosevelt had trouble getting Congress to approve that aide. So there was an urgent need to create the political will and public support for us to enter the war.

Also, the Japanese had made it plain that they were on a war footing and intended to expand their empire across Asia, and that they were planning on war with America in order to cripple our ability to exert influence in the Asian Pacific. They were going to go to war with us, it was just a matter of when. So with that in mind, I can conceive of Roosevelt believing that it was better to get the start of the war over with. So he could have figured why not let them go ahead and get close and then repel the attack close to Hawaii, once radar picks up the fleet aircraft?

The problem of course was that radar was SO new, and the operators so inexperienced, and procedures for reporting and checking on detected aircraft were not yet well established. So when the report was sent about the planes approaching the island, the officer who got the report assumed they were planes coming in from the west coast (even though they were coming from the west, not the east as those planes would have been), and nothing was done. So the attack proceeded completely unhindered. And thousands died.

As to the other rumors you mentioned, yes there are plenty of crazy ideas floating around. There are some people who seem to get a kick out of creating wild stories and posting them somewhere just to see how many people will believe and repeat them. I can't see how someone would get enjoyment from that, but apparently some people do.

But I want to make it clear, I was only trying to be funny.

Ha, I thought you might just be having some fun, but I wasn't sure. So the joke is on me and you got me.

The thing is, you could probably post your joke about the REAL origin of this movie on a website dedicated to spreading it as the truth, and just like with the flat-earthers, I bet you'd get a lot of likes and some serious discussion on the matter. Again, it would be an example of where the Internet has made us dumber.

Anyway, thank you for your posts, and I hope you have a nice evening:)

Well, you were being gracious. You didn't call me an idiot for believing such a tale. lol

Enjoyed the discussion.