Hollywood has always had a sort of "convenient morality" on the subjects of rape, pedophilia and incest. That's a euphemism. In pain terms, Hollywood loves stories of sexual depravity and calls them "art". Just look at the most applauded films of Woody Allen which were almost always about a creepy old guy and a very young girl. Even beyond the scandal of him marrying his own stepdaughter, even beyond the scandal of Woody's other (7-year old) adopted daughter publicly exposing him for sexually abusing her, Hollywood didn't bat an eyelid because Woody was making big $$$ for the industry. That's like firing your best worker because you caught him jacking off outside the women's restroom; they'll do everything they can to overlook it. It takes an avalanche of scandals for Hollywood to admit something stinks, and then of course they all jump on the bandwagon and pretend like they were against it all along. I'm pretty sure Roman Polanski is still the Hollywood darling even though he can't set foot in America because he'll be locked up on rape charges. If these creeps can get away with it, then directors like PTA have free rein because at least PTA doesn't have any charges pending (yet). Moral of the story, Hollywood doesn't lead progress, it follows but loud enough to make themselves look good.

@mechajutaro said:

Just look at the most applauded films of Woody Allen which were almost always about a creepy old guy and a very young girl

None of Allen's heroines were little girls in middle school, in which case we'd all be remiss if we didn't call him out for a being a white R-Kelly. All the gals in these movies were women who were well over the age of 18. However weird his marrying his stepdaughter is, it's a gross distortion of the facts to claim that he's a pedophile or has endorse pedophilia

even beyond the scandal of Woody's other (7-year old) adopted daughter publicly exposing him for sexually abusing her, Hollywood didn't bat an eyelid because Woody was making big $$$ for the industry.

I'd encourage you to dig into those allegations, rather than believing every sensationalistic headline and story out there, before jumping to the conclusion that Allen is guilty of such a heinous crime. The idea that Tinseltown is protecting him, on account of the money his movies are pulling in, doesn't hold up when one takes a look at the box office receipts for his last several films. Flicks like Match Point, Vicky Cristina Barcelona, and any of that other less than memorable schmaltz he's been putting out since the 2000s haven't come anywhere close to being as profitable as every Micheal Bay film that has been released during that same time period

We agree on Hollywood's moral posturing being little more than...well, posturing. Even in these Woke Times in which we currently live, shows like 13 Reasons Why will regurgitate all the Far Left platitudes about The Male Gaze in one breath, and then in the next gift us all with an eyeful of Katherine Langford stripping down to her lacy black underwear, then jumping into a hot tub. This same series has features so many glimpses of teeny-bopper side boob, one could easily make a drinking game out of said spectacle

So blinded by your agenda that you missed the point again, mech.

@mechajutaro said:

So blinded by your agenda that you missed the point again, mech.

If by agenda you mean refusal to simply give into mob mentality, and to encourage independent thought, then yeah, you've get me Roos. I won't be jumping up on the let's-run-Woody Allen out of town on a rail bandwagon, just because Vanity Fair ran a story by Ronan Farrow accusing Allen of being a pedophile. Last I checked, the editorial board at this same publication has been highly resistant to all of those who've pointed the rampant inconsistencies in this same story, and they've given no weight to the refutations of these allegations offered by several of Allen and Farrow's other children

It's a a real leap to say that just because somebody is weird(and Woody Allen most definitely is), any allegations of child molestation that are hurled at him must therefore be true

well alllrighty then

Sometimes people need to know how to separate fiction from reality. OP, don't google Lolita.

@rooprect I thought about Woody Allen as I watched this, and there is a difference. One is that the love interest in Manhattan is 17, not 15. One is less than a year away from legality, and the other still has a ways to go. The other is that Woody Allen's character doesn't get the girl in the end. In Licorice Pizza, they kiss and run off like the relationship is going to continue.

I wish they would have gotten an actual 15-year-old to play the part because then he would have looked a bit younger and people wouldn't handwave it so much. The fact that he's 18 prevents people from being critical about the situation. I bet they didn't want it to be a distraction, which is funny because it's as if they wanted to indulge in the fantasy without the moral baggage that comes with it. They want it for free.

@defjeff said:

@rooprect I thought about Woody Allen as I watched this, and there is a difference. One is that the love interest in Manhattan is 17, not 15. One is less than a year away from legality, and the other still has a ways to go. The other is that Woody Allen's character doesn't get the girl in the end. In Licorice Pizza, they kiss and run off like the relationship is going to continue.

I wish they would have gotten an actual 15-year-old to play the part because then he would have looked a bit younger and people wouldn't handwave it so much. The fact that he's 18 prevents people from being critical about the situation. I bet they didn't want it to be a distraction, which is funny because it's as if they wanted to indulge in the fantasy without the moral baggage that comes with it. They want it for free.

Filming on Licorice Pizza took place over 68 days, starting in August 2020 and wrapping in November 2020. Alana Haim (born Dec 13, 1991) was 28 at the time. Cooper Hoffman (born Mar 1, 2003) was 17 when it was filmed. Alana Haim is 11 years and 2.5 months older than Cooper Hoffman.

During the film, another adult woman, who apparently had been previously driving Gary around, told Alana that she had been giving Gary "hand-jobs. Now you can do it." In real life, there have been plenty of adult women who have gone to prison for having sexual relations with minor boys. They probably all thought "we were meant for each other."

In this film, Gary is a budding entrepreneur, a winner with vision. A girl his own age was involved with him romantically, at one point. Alana is a 25-year-old loser, who was taking high school yearbook pictures for money, and living with her parents. She wanted to bring home a nice Jewish man to impress her parents, and couldn't find one. They were not "meant for each other."

Paul Thomas Anderson was born in 1970 and this film is set in the summer-autumn of 1973. So he had no first-hand knowledge of what anything was like at that time.

@defjeff said:

I wish they would have gotten an actual 15-year-old to play the part because then he would have looked a bit younger and people wouldn't handwave it so much. The fact that he's 18 prevents people from being critical about the situation. I bet they didn't want it to be a distraction, which is funny because it's as if they wanted to indulge in the fantasy without the moral baggage that comes with it. They want it for free.

This is such an important thought, I wish more people would realize how it applies to cinema in so many areas. Like you said, when they get older actors to play sexualized minors it has the effect of airbrushing the disturbing implications, and people find themselves excusing or even salivating at disturbing content. Don't get me started on that show Euphoria about a bunch of horny 'teenagers' played by a cast that's mostly in their mid to late 20s, some pushing 30. Like you said, the audience gets to indulge in a voyeuristic fantasy without the moral baggage.

Switching gears but on the exact same theme, how about the way mainstream movies have always handled violence? The 'good guy' kills the 'bad guy' with a quick bop on the head, or a quippy 1-liner to punctuate a bullet shot to a swelling symphony soundtrack, and the audience goes home happy. Once again, it's fantasy without the moral baggage of realism. I think it was "Heavenly Creatures" (1994) where I first saw a killing that truly disturbed me to my core because it showed how damn hard & messy it is to kill a person. No emotional manipulation or schlocky theatrics, we see a woman get murdered and it's ugly as hell.