@SusanneK wrote:

Item: Gunpowder Milkshake
Language: de-DE
Type of Problem: Design_issue

Thanks for your report!

2- The order below the main cast doesn't seem to follow any rules.

There is a small section in our Contribution Bible that explains how cast members should be listed/ordered. But many users either don't know or don't care about these rules/recommendations and just add stuff. That's why many cast lists seem confusing and wrong. Also, keep in mind that many users add cast members before movies have been released based on (official and non-official) sources such as newspaper articles, tweets, etc. Or - which is very bad - just copy all the data drom IMDb without looking at official credits. And then someone has to fix the order based on the actual screen credits when the movie is finally released.

So, the rules are clear from the Bible: Main cast first and ordered by importance/relevance of the character/role -> guest cast follows based on the order of the official onscreen credits.

3- Even for the main cast, it's not clear why Chloe Coleman would be put below Freya Allan as the rules here don't seem to go by order of title credits for the main cast either and Chloe Coleman's character has significantly more screentime and weight in the film.

Yes, that was wrong. I watched the movie this morning and "shuffled" the cast around:

https://www.themoviedb.org/movie/574060-gunpowder-milkshake/cast

The first 10 people are the main cast in the order that I think is most accurate; the rest is ordered by the official end credits (screenshot). What do you think? Do you agree with that order?

Also -> if you see any mistakes that I made, you can just reply here! I always do lots of stupid mistakes when I add a lot of data...

Thank you, looks correct to me now.

And yes, I had checked the Contribution Bible and just didn't see that the rules had been applied before locking the order.

Actually think the idea to sort the cast by relevance of the characters is a good idea for people who're looking for guidance but it's more useful for the cast below the main cast. From experience as a fan of actors who are rarely credited as main cast, I know that when you are aware that your favourite actor/actress is unlikely to have a main part, it's crucial to find out if the thing is worth spending money on before you see it - which is mainly determined by the question how much weight and screentime you can estimate for the character of your fave.

Taking this film as an example, I would say for instance, admittedly without having counted exact minutes and lines, that Ivan Kaye's and Michael Smiley's characters are of comparable relevance, just that one of them got a title credit while the other strangely didn't. Just trying to make clear what I mean, I know according to the rules it's irrelevant and I understand that the downside of this approach is that it's open to dispute. But I find it very useful and would suggest extending it to the whole cast. One could take the number of minutes on screen together with the number of lines as an objective measure in case of dispute and sort those who're on the same level alphabetically (like they did in this movie with the character names when the appearance was simultaneous). But that's just a suggestion.

@SusanneK wrote:

And yes, I had checked the Contribution Bible and just didn't see that the rules had been applied before locking the order.

Yes, the order was almost correct, only a few small mistakes. And mistakes happen - so it's good that you reported it!

Actually think the idea to sort the cast by relevance of the characters is a good idea for people who're looking for guidance but it's more useful for the cast below the main cast. From experience as a fan of actors who are rarely credited as main cast, I know that when you are aware that your favourite actor/actress is unlikely to have a main part, it's crucial to find out if the thing is worth spending money on before you see it - which is mainly determined by the question how much weight and screentime you can estimate for the character of your fave.

I do understand your point of view, but I see the big problem that ordering the cast by relevance would be much harder to achieve in reality - and it takes more time for everyone. I doubt that many people here on TMDb would be interested in discussions about weight/screentime of particular actresses/actors per each movie - I can't imagine that this issue is relevant for most people who use TMDb. I might be wrong about that - but it's something that I wouldn't expect TMDb to offer me. If I want to find out about someone playing a role in a movie, I either watch it or I look for reviews. I would never consider to take a look at the order of the cast to find out.

But I find it very useful and would suggest extending it to the whole cast.

I can't tell you when the current recommendation was established - that was most likely long before I joined TMDb. And I have no idea how the other moderators and other users think about it?