Neither. They were both human beings with flaws.

It could be argued that JGL was a douche and ZD was a bitch. But the film was made in 2009 back when people were complex human beings with a myriad of different characteristics. So lets not 2 dimensionalize them by applying today's contrived social justice labels.

Rant out of the way, looking back at the film, and my memory is hazy so I could be wrong, but I don't actually remember JGL displaying any stalkerish behavior or any behavior that could be described even by today's eccentric activists as questionable . As far as I can remember once it was over he kept to himself and just moped about in a depression.

I remember he did go and see her at a wedding or a funeral or a party or something like that but whatever it was he was invited to it he didn't just crash it in a drunken stupor. And he got on well with her there and wasn't pushy or whiny and she seemed even happy to see him. In fact even ZD's character gave no indication that she thought his behavior was questionable. He behaved like a guy who was heartbroken. He'd got the wrong impression and let his emotions run away with him.

I don't have a problem with ZD's character either. As you said, she was upfront about things but we are seeing her through his perceptions and that's kind of the point of it. She may be a bit naive, just as he is. Neither were perfect. If these characters didn't have negative traits I wouldn't believe them as characters.

@JustinJackFlash said:

Neither. They were both human beings with flaws.

It could be argued that JGL was a douche and ZD was a bitch. But the film was made in 2009 back when people were complex human beings with a myriad of different characteristics. So lets not 2 dimensionalize them by applying today's contrived social justice labels.

Rant out of the way, looking back at the film, and my memory is hazy so I could be wrong, but I don't actually remember JGL displaying any stalkerish behavior or any behavior that could be described even by today's eccentric activists as questionable . As far as I can remember once it was over he kept to himself and just moped about in a depression.

I remember he did go and see her at a wedding or a funeral or a party or something like that but whatever it was he was invited to it he didn't just crash it in a drunken stupor. And he got on well with her there and wasn't pushy or whiny and she seemed even happy to see him. In fact even ZD's character gave no indication that she thought his behavior was questionable. He behaved like a guy who was heartbroken. He'd got the wrong impression and let his emotions run away with him.

I don't have a problem with ZD's character either. As you said, she was upfront about things but we are seeing her through his perceptions and that's kind of the point of it. She may be a bit naive, just as he is. Neither were perfect. If these characters didn't have negative traits I wouldn't believe them as characters.

Great honest response Justin!

Yeah I was bit confused to see people considering JGL to be toxic and even stalkerish myself. He didnt really really seem all that aggressive either kind of passive if anything. For a young man to pursue a young woman in todays dating world or when this movie was made is always difficult. Both men and women play games, emotions run wild and like you said we are all human and flawed.

For those saying JGL was toxic and stalkerish WTF was he supposed to do to pursue Summer? He pretty much respected her wishes all the sex was obviously consensual.

Again Summer was pretty clear she did not want a boyfriend, didnt want drama/labels, JGL knew this but of course still fell for her. I guess the part that was most painful for viewers was when Summer explained that she got married because she knew right away there was no doubt with him, but with JGL there was always doubt. That does suck but shoot at the end of the day you should marry the ONE for you and not the one who just there. Summer did make it clear she did not want anything serious so anyone should either view her as a friends with benefits type or move on.

The interesting thing was most of the ones criticizing Summer were female believe it or not and the ones criticizing JGL character were male.

@mechajutaro said:

Subject of being Toxic and who was Toxic in this movie?

No one in the movie was being toxic. Contemporary reviewers who've spent entirely too much time in gender studies class, and who are now desperately reading sinister undertones into even the most innocuous of movies, on the other hand....

I agree I was actually confused and shocked as to why a ton of people on social media felt Summer or JGL was toxic. Like do they even know what toxic really is? LOL

I even saw some girls say they can't watch this movie again because it caused them such PTSD. LIKE WHAAAAT? How soft has this newer younger generation become?????

@MrCharmingMan said:

Great honest response Justin!

Cheers, dude!

Yeah I was bit confused to see people considering JGL to be toxic and even stalkerish myself. He didnt really really seem all that aggressive either kind of passive if anything. For a young man to pursue a young woman in todays dating world or when this movie was made is always difficult. Both men and women play games, emotions run wild and like you said we are all human and flawed.

For those saying JGL was toxic and stalkerish WTF was he supposed to do to pursue Summer? He pretty much respected her wishes all the sex was obviously consensual.

Exactly. The societal expectation has always been on the man to be the pursuer. The one who has to put himself out there and risk rejection. And that isn't something that's easy to do yet women will criticize the way they do this and today will even make them out to be some great villain for not doing it in exactly the right way they want them to. Which is of course going to be subjective depending on the lady in question.

The thing is that women tend not to realize that this sort of thing can be difficult for men to do. When women pursue men they are far less likely to get rejected. In fact if a woman were to approach a man (usually) all she would have to do is say 'Hello'. That's it. How many men are going to tell her to fuck off? Spin that around and imagine a man walking up to a woman and just saying 'Hello' and things would probably go quite differently. Especially today. So from their perspective they probably think it's quite easy and wonder how men can get things so catastrophically wrong so frequently.

So women generally have the upper hand in the early part of the dating game. And this is an aspect where women do actually have a benefit over men. It's always completely ignored and not taken into account. So the fact that people can be so easily critical of the way a man conducts himself during this phase (and that's not to say that there aren't men who do behave terribly) and that this makes them out to be such a huge menace and part of an evil patriarchal and oppressive society is crazy. Especially when it's not men's choice to have this societal expectation of pursuer placed upon them.

Unfortunately JGL got things wrong in this situation. And I would criticize him by saying that he takes things too seriously. But this is a character aspect that is explained well in the beginning of the film when it says of his misunderstanding of the ending to The Graduate and general exposure to pop culture indoctrinating him into certain beliefs about love. But I wouldn't criticize him for being some great menace. He's guilty merely of being human.

I even saw some girls say they can't watch this movie again because it caused them such PTSD. LIKE WHAAAAT? How soft has this newer younger generation become?????

It's because this newer generation are the first generation to grow up with the heavy prevalence of i-phones. They live their life through the internet and don't get exposed to real life much. They don't have bad things happen to them as much in order to build up a basic resilience to the general trials and hardships of life. With lockdown people are living more and more at home now and working/attending school through the internet. So I wonder how that's going to effect people. Things could get worse.

But these particular girls you speak of sound very pampered. They probably have no idea what PTSD actually is. They revel in their elitist "activism" without realizing that their claim of PTSD is actually belittling the illness for people who genuinely suffer from it.

@JustinJackFlash said:

@MrCharmingMan said:

Great honest response Justin!

Cheers, dude!

Yeah I was bit confused to see people considering JGL to be toxic and even stalkerish myself. He didnt really really seem all that aggressive either kind of passive if anything. For a young man to pursue a young woman in todays dating world or when this movie was made is always difficult. Both men and women play games, emotions run wild and like you said we are all human and flawed.

For those saying JGL was toxic and stalkerish WTF was he supposed to do to pursue Summer? He pretty much respected her wishes all the sex was obviously consensual.

Exactly. The societal expectation has always been on the man to be the pursuer. The one who has to put himself out there and risk rejection. And that isn't something that's easy to do yet women will criticize the way they do this and today will even make them out to be some great villain for not doing it in exactly the right way they want them to. Which is of course going to be subjective depending on the lady in question.

The thing is that women tend not to realize that this sort of thing can be difficult for men to do. When women pursue men they are far less likely to get rejected. In fact if a woman were to approach a man (usually) all she would have to do is say 'Hello'. That's it. How many men are going to tell her to fuck off? Spin that around and imagine a man walking up to a woman and just saying 'Hello' and things would probably go quite differently. Especially today. So from their perspective they probably think it's quite easy and wonder how men can get things so catastrophically wrong so frequently.

So women generally have the upper hand in the early part of the dating game. And this is an aspect where women do actually have a benefit over men. It's always completely ignored and not taken into account. So the fact that people can be so easily critical of the way a man conducts himself during this phase (and that's not to say that there aren't men who do behave terribly) and that this makes them out to be such a huge menace and part of an evil patriarchal and oppressive society is crazy. Especially when it's not men's choice to have this societal expectation of pursuer placed upon them.

Unfortunately JGL got things wrong in this situation. And I would criticize him by saying that he takes things too seriously. But this is a character aspect that is explained well in the beginning of the film when it says of his misunderstanding of the ending to The Graduate and general exposure to pop culture indoctrinating him into certain beliefs about love. But I wouldn't criticize him for being some great menace. He's guilty merely of being human.

I even saw some girls say they can't watch this movie again because it caused them such PTSD. LIKE WHAAAAT? How soft has this newer younger generation become?????

It's because this newer generation are the first generation to grow up with the heavy prevalence of i-phones. They live their life through the internet and don't get exposed to real life much. They don't have bad things happen to them as much in order to build up a basic resilience to the general trials and hardships of life. With lockdown people are living more and more at home now and working/attending school through the internet. So I wonder how that's going to effect people. Things could get worse.

But these particular girls you speak of sound very pampered. They probably have no idea what PTSD actually is. They revel in their elitist "activism" without realizing that their claim of PTSD is actually belittling the illness for people who genuinely suffer from it.

Yeah I usually go on social media, usually Twitter to see what others thought of a movie I recently watched. For the most part theres always mixed opinions of course outside of the biased hardcore fans. That is why I was confused and shocked to see so many saying such extreme exaggerated things about this movie?

I agree with you on that society makes it so a young man has to pursue a young woman its more natural and easier while still in your 20's or in college or in the bar/club scene demographic. But the older you get those opportunities really get dried up. I know some guys who NEVER and I mean NEVER went for it and so they lost out on so many chances and now they are in their 40's today and have no clue how to meet or talk to women. I always told them yo you gotta meet chicks now because the longer you wait the harder it will come. I remember there was some stat that said like if you have not met or married someone by your late 30's the chances of meeting the one are like less than getting hit by lightning or something ridiculous like that. To clarify what I'm saying, I'll point out that the more you try the more chances and odds will be on your side.(It's a numbers game but if you dont even try the chances are zero percent or even worse) You will also become more comfortable and perfect your skill or methods whatever you wanna call it, the more you try to practice. So going back to the two guys I was mentioning they never even tried and now they are completely S.O.L. as all of their friends are now married with kids and doing the family thing. The pandemic was the final nail in the coffin as they have not even gone out for a year and half so their already lack of swag and game is now about 20 times worse than it was before.

But back to the movie, usually girls who say what Summer did(regarding no boyfriend, no labels, no drama) tend to either want to focus on their career, school, or goals in life first and thats why they are the way they are. Summer was not like this at all? So she could not use that as a reason. We also learned that Summer had a lot of former lovers or hook ups from all over the world so its not like she was doing this for religious reasons or waiting for her true husband or some other BS reason. It was never clearly stated but it seemed Summer really just wanted to keep her options open until she found the one. So since she never considered JGL the one, she knew this right away. So she knew the whole time she was dating him that he was not the one for her, because again she even said there was always doubt and uncertainty with JGL, but with her husband she knew right away that he was the one and there was no doubt.

Really excellent point on how the younger generation really have not lived and are always hiding behind their iPhones. We all can agree real PTSD is going to war, or surviving something absolutely violent, brutal, and traumatizing, watching a sad rom com should never qualify for PTSD in any way shape or form. Its almost like how these younger generation misuse the term PTSD for they dont even know what true PTSD is.

Oh yeah back to the women determining who should pursue them and how it should be done the right way. One of my cousins was like this. She had the perfect boyfriend that we all loved and thought he was be a great addition to our family if they got married, but what does she do she dumps him because she felt his career goals were not in line with hers. He had some average college grad level job but she felt that wasn't good enough for her so she dumps him and like 6 months later is marrying some guy in Dental school, assuming he'd become a baller dentist. None of our family is feeling the new guy and we're all like WTF? They barely even know each other and only been dating for less than 4 months at this point. So they get married and he turns out to be a total dud. He tried to open up his own dental office and no one came to his office because dentists are often successful based on their popularity and customer service/personality and word of mouth etc. He was some guy with no personality, no social skills, just not a real friendly or a person that you feel comfortable or trusting in going to see as your dentist. So my cousin ends up being the breadwinner of the family and all her career money goes to paying for everything. So in the end if this was the case she should have stuck it out with the first boyfriend since he was a likable good guy that everyone actually liked.

It would be interesting to see how my cousin ends up if she ends up divorcing him and finding a new husband? It wouldn't be all that surprising. But yes as you pointed out, my cousin is a great example of how women do have the upper hand and are the ones really calling the shots. Whats F'd up is if they decide to get divorced they end up taking the guy to the cleaners too on top of all the other BS we already discussed. But I guess thats a whole other topic that we won't go into.

I totally forgot about the Graduate metaphor or reference that you pointed out? Perhaps I should re-watch that part?

I did like how the movie gave us a countdown of the days left until 500 Days was up. I also like how they pointed out that this was not a love story and it doesn't end happy. I like when films do things outside the norm and box that we are so used to.

Oh one more interesting point about how you mentioned the pandemic making everything even worse, I heard one sociology/historical study that said during our last pandemic, which was the Flu almost a hundred years ago, when the pandemic finally ended there was a huge shift in everyone becoming pretty much promiscuous and even big orgies taking place because of all the lockdown cabin fever built up for that entire pandemic. So far from what I see we have not gone that route yet, would be interesting if we do end up having a similar stage as that though?

@MrCharmingMan said:

I agree with you on that society makes it so a young man has to pursue a young woman its more natural and easier while still in your 20's or in college or in the bar/club scene demographic. But the older you get those opportunities really get dried up. I know some guys who NEVER and I mean NEVER went for it and so they lost out on so many chances and now they are in their 40's today and have no clue how to meet or talk to women. I always told them yo you gotta meet chicks now because the longer you wait the harder it will come. I remember there was some stat that said like if you have not met or married someone by your late 30's the chances of meeting the one are like less than getting hit by lightning or something ridiculous like that. To clarify what I'm saying, I'll point out that the more you try the more chances and odds will be on your side.(It's a numbers game but if you dont even try the chances are zero percent or even worse) You will also become more comfortable and perfect your skill or methods whatever you wanna call it, the more you try to practice. So going back to the two guys I was mentioning they never even tried and now they are completely S.O.L. as all of their friends are now married with kids and doing the family thing. The pandemic was the final nail in the coffin as they have not even gone out for a year and half so their already lack of swag and game is now about 20 times worse than it was before.

Oh yeah back to the women determining who should pursue them and how it should be done the right way. One of my cousins was like this. She had the perfect boyfriend that we all loved and thought he was be a great addition to our family if they got married, but what does she do she dumps him because she felt his career goals were not in line with hers. He had some average college grad level job but she felt that wasn't good enough for her so she dumps him and like 6 months later is marrying some guy in Dental school, assuming he'd become a baller dentist. None of our family is feeling the new guy and we're all like WTF? They barely even know each other and only been dating for less than 4 months at this point. So they get married and he turns out to be a total dud. He tried to open up his own dental office and no one came to his office because dentists are often successful based on their popularity and customer service/personality and word of mouth etc. He was some guy with no personality, no social skills, just not a real friendly or a person that you feel comfortable or trusting in going to see as your dentist. So my cousin ends up being the breadwinner of the family and all her career money goes to paying for everything. So in the end if this was the case she should have stuck it out with the first boyfriend since he was a likable good guy that everyone actually liked.

It would be interesting to see how my cousin ends up if she ends up divorcing him and finding a new husband? It wouldn't be all that surprising. But yes as you pointed out, my cousin is a great example of how women do have the upper hand and are the ones really calling the shots. Whats F'd up is if they decide to get divorced they end up taking the guy to the cleaners too on top of all the other BS we already discussed. But I guess thats a whole other topic that we won't go into.

Yup, women are the choosers and the men are the dancing monkeys who have to measure up to their standards. And I'm not saying that there won't be women with problems in this area too, but it is definitely slanted in favour of women. And this is never spoken about or acknowledged today. It's just not acceptable to suggest that women might have an advantage in any way over men.

And while there is often talk of men being the bread earner and having the better job and being the head of the household, etc etc, it is only ever spoken about in a particular way. As if these labels always put the man in a position of privilege. And for many I'm sure it does. But the flipside of that coin is that it puts men in a position of pressure. How often do you hear the story of a man losing his job and not being able to provide for his family, so the wife leaves him and takes the kids. The man often becomes an alcoholic and this sometimes leads to suicide. Now have you ever heard of a case when a man leaves his wife and takes the kids because she loses her job?

These stereotypical privileges don't necessarily set a man up to have a better life than a woman. So you can view these things in a different way. The woman has things better because she is provided for and has more safety. The man has things worse because he has more pressure. And I'm not saying either way is the way things always are. It'll be different for different people and things aren't that simple and black and white.

Bear in mind I don't encourage the idea of gender roles, I do think things should be flexible depending on the people and both genders should have the freedom to choose. I'm simply commenting on the one sided way of looking at traditional gender roles and the reluctance to see them any other way except Man-priveleged and Woman- oppressed.

I totally forgot about the Graduate metaphor or reference that you pointed out? Perhaps I should re-watch that part?

It's right at the beginning. I thought that whole intro was a great way of dissecting why people have very specific and unrealistic/unhealthy views of love. Because we're immersed in it from a young age by popular culture. So that you would even misinterpret a films ending due to your trained romantic idealism.

I did like how the movie gave us a countdown of the days left until 500 Days was up. I also like how they pointed out that this was not a love story and it doesn't end happy. I like when films do things outside the norm and box that we are so used to.

Yes, and how when he meets Autumn at the end the clock gets reset and starts again. I find few films pull off a great satisfying ending but this one's was perfect. It managed to be realistic while still being optimistic. He lost Summer but he moved on and the film showed how there tends to be another opportunity just around the corner. Yet it also suggested there will be drama with this one too. I thought it was a great film at the time and although it got good reviews I don't think it gets the credit it deserves. I think it's a modern classic. I don't find there are many films about love that are very good. They're usually just cliched rom coms or overly sappy. It works because it's a film about moving on. And it understands this.

Oh one more interesting point about how you mentioned the pandemic making everything even worse, I heard one sociology/historical study th at said during our last pandemic, which was the Flu almost a hundred years ago, when the pandemic finally ended there was a huge shift in everyone becoming pretty much promiscuous and even big orgies taking place because of all the lockdown cabin fever built up for that entire pandemic. So far from what I see we have not gone that route yet, would be interesting if we do end up having a similar stage as that though?

It's probably exactly what this world needs, lol. To relaaax.

@JustinJackFlash said:

@MrCharmingMan said:

I agree with you on that society makes it so a young man has to pursue a young woman its more natural and easier while still in your 20's or in college or in the bar/club scene demographic. But the older you get those opportunities really get dried up. I know some guys who NEVER and I mean NEVER went for it and so they lost out on so many chances and now they are in their 40's today and have no clue how to meet or talk to women. I always told them yo you gotta meet chicks now because the longer you wait the harder it will come. I remember there was some stat that said like if you have not met or married someone by your late 30's the chances of meeting the one are like less than getting hit by lightning or something ridiculous like that. To clarify what I'm saying, I'll point out that the more you try the more chances and odds will be on your side.(It's a numbers game but if you dont even try the chances are zero percent or even worse) You will also become more comfortable and perfect your skill or methods whatever you wanna call it, the more you try to practice. So going back to the two guys I was mentioning they never even tried and now they are completely S.O.L. as all of their friends are now married with kids and doing the family thing. The pandemic was the final nail in the coffin as they have not even gone out for a year and half so their already lack of swag and game is now about 20 times worse than it was before.

Oh yeah back to the women determining who should pursue them and how it should be done the right way. One of my cousins was like this. She had the perfect boyfriend that we all loved and thought he was be a great addition to our family if they got married, but what does she do she dumps him because she felt his career goals were not in line with hers. He had some average college grad level job but she felt that wasn't good enough for her so she dumps him and like 6 months later is marrying some guy in Dental school, assuming he'd become a baller dentist. None of our family is feeling the new guy and we're all like WTF? They barely even know each other and only been dating for less than 4 months at this point. So they get married and he turns out to be a total dud. He tried to open up his own dental office and no one came to his office because dentists are often successful based on their popularity and customer service/personality and word of mouth etc. He was some guy with no personality, no social skills, just not a real friendly or a person that you feel comfortable or trusting in going to see as your dentist. So my cousin ends up being the breadwinner of the family and all her career money goes to paying for everything. So in the end if this was the case she should have stuck it out with the first boyfriend since he was a likable good guy that everyone actually liked.

It would be interesting to see how my cousin ends up if she ends up divorcing him and finding a new husband? It wouldn't be all that surprising. But yes as you pointed out, my cousin is a great example of how women do have the upper hand and are the ones really calling the shots. Whats F'd up is if they decide to get divorced they end up taking the guy to the cleaners too on top of all the other BS we already discussed. But I guess thats a whole other topic that we won't go into.

Yup, women are the choosers and the men are the dancing monkeys who have to measure up to their standards. And I'm not saying that there won't be women with problems in this area too, but it is definitely slanted in favour of women. And this is never spoken about or acknowledged today. It's just not acceptable to suggest that women might have an advantage in any way over men.

And while there is often talk of men being the bread earner and having the better job and being the head of the household, etc etc, it is only ever spoken about in a particular way. As if these labels always put the man in a position of privilege. And for many I'm sure it does. But the flipside of that coin is that it puts men in a position of pressure. How often do you hear the story of a man losing his job and not being able to provide for his family, so the wife leaves him and takes the kids. The man often becomes an alcoholic and this sometimes leads to suicide. Now have you ever heard of a case when a man leaves his wife and takes the kids because she loses her job?

These stereotypical privileges don't necessarily set a man up to have a better life than a woman. So you can view these things in a different way. The woman has things better because she is provided for and has more safety. The man has things worse because he has more pressure. And I'm not saying either way is the way things always are. It'll be different for different people and things aren't that simple and black and white.

Bear in mind I don't encourage the idea of gender roles, I do think things should be flexible depending on the people and both genders should have the freedom to choose. I'm simply commenting on the one sided way of looking at traditional gender roles and the reluctance to see them any other way except Man-priveleged and Woman- oppressed.

I totally forgot about the Graduate metaphor or reference that you pointed out? Perhaps I should re-watch that part?

It's right at the beginning. I thought that whole intro was a great way of dissecting why people have very specific and unrealistic/unhealthy views of love. Because we're immersed in it from a young age by popular culture. So that you would even misinterpret a films ending due to your trained romantic idealism.

I did like how the movie gave us a countdown of the days left until 500 Days was up. I also like how they pointed out that this was not a love story and it doesn't end happy. I like when films do things outside the norm and box that we are so used to.

Yes, and how when he meets Autumn at the end the clock gets reset and starts again. I find few films pull off a great satisfying ending but this one's was perfect. It managed to be realistic while still being optimistic. He lost Summer but he moved on and the film showed how there tends to be another opportunity just around the corner. Yet it also suggested there will be drama with this one too. I thought it was a great film at the time and although it got good reviews I don't think it gets the credit it deserves. I think it's a modern classic. I don't find there are many films about love that are very good. They're usually just cliched rom coms or overly sappy. It works because it's a film about moving on. And it understands this.

Oh one more interesting point about how you mentioned the pandemic making everything even worse, I heard one sociology/historical study th at said during our last pandemic, which was the Flu almost a hundred years ago, when the pandemic finally ended there was a huge shift in everyone becoming pretty much promiscuous and even big orgies taking place because of all the lockdown cabin fever built up for that entire pandemic. So far from what I see we have not gone that route yet, would be interesting if we do end up having a similar stage as that though?

It's probably exactly what this world needs, lol. To relaaax.

Justin!

WHOA bro I just re-watched the first 5 minutes and the last 5 minutes of the movie! Yeah I totally missed all of that you pointed out.

First off this movie was really good in hindsight, I must have been 1/2 awake or drunk or only partially focused on the movie when I watched it. You were absolutely correct it said JGL was raised on "SAD British Pop music" and just as you pointed out missed the point of the Graduate! Where as Summer was pretty much anti-love, anti-relationships because her parents divorced when she was young! This totally went over my head the first time but after re-watching it yes you are totally correct. So here we have JGL the stereotypical feminine influences sad love songs, rom movies, and then we have Summer being more so a stereotypical dude being a child from a broken family who's like F love, all she cared about was her black hair chopping it off and it growing back just as fast. So yeah you absolutely nailed this!

As for the last 5 minutes of the movie I saw the tail end of JGL sitting on the bench and then as Summer walks away he says I truly hope you are happy. This shows that JGL is a decent person and really does seem sincere and wants the best for her even if its not with him as much as it hurts him. That is pretty deep. But again it shows that JGL was not toxic, not a stalker, he wasn't even aggressive or assertive with her! But more importantly as we meet Autumn, I noticed JGL comes in and looks all around the damn office, especially upward toward the ceiling and doesn't even notice theres a person sitting there. Autumn even needs to catch his attention.

They talk and then Autumns like hey I know you, I seen you around Angelus plaza. JGL is like I love that place its my favorite place really? I never seen you before? Autumn's like I guess you never looked before. So this told me that JGL was so consumed and focused on Summer the whole time he missed this really hot girl who was also into what he was into and who was even checking him out. I'm also going to give my honest blunt opinion and say Autumn's waaaaay hotter than Summer! I mean Zoey is attractive, more so cute than anything but DAMN Autumn's way smoking hot! I took this as an absolute UPGRADE!

You also made an excellent point on how if things go south for a man vs a woman, the man often crumbles to nothing, losing his family, house, kids, life and even turns to alcoholism or suicide, where as if things go south for the woman or even her husband she just leaves and gives another guy a try. We would like to think in 2021 things are much different, but they are not. There are cases where the woman is the breadwinner as in my cousin's case or in a few of my friends cases but in those situations the man is definitely hanging on by a thread and on their last legs and pretty much screwed if their wives decide they want to upgrade or try someone new. In all of those examples all of those women seem like they would find a new husband quite easily with little to no trouble at all. Or even just be independent and of course have the alimony payments come in on top of everything else.

One of my uncles was this way. He married a really hot woman(my aunt through marriage) and like once she hit like late 30's she said F this I want the good life and just left him was already dating around a few ballers who in her karma turned out to be fake ballers pretending to be millionaires when they were not even wealthy or successful at all. My uncle was destroyed turned to alcohol as you pointed out even ended up in prison with a DUI. It took him about 10 years to bounce back. At his lowest point when he had nothing his business was on the brink of closing he had to pay her alimony per month even though she was the one who cheated on him and was dating other men and she was making more money than he was doing some high level sales job. She was driving the brand new BMW 7 series and wearing like $10,000.00 dresses and had a mansion up on the hills and he had nothing. So yeah exactly like you explained!

But what advice do you have for those 2 guys I mentioned who NEVER even got started and never even tried to meet chicks? Is it a lost cause? I pretty much gave up on them years ago as I tried like hell to help them(I did everything from being their best wingman, inviting them to parties, concerts, trips, Vegas, happy hour, etc etc.) as most of our mutual friends all gave up on them like 10 years ago. I always wondered how they would end up, but it seems pretty obvious how things will end for them since they NEVER tried and have no desire to even attempt to try.

Again you are correct 500 Days of Summer is a master piece. I think its one of those movies that will stand the test of time and maybe soon other films will try to steal or copy but won't nail it as well as this one was produced.

@MrCharmingMan said:

First off this movie was really good in hindsight, I must have been 1/2 awake or drunk or only partially focused on the movie when I watched it. You were absolutely correct it said JGL was raised on "SAD British Pop music" and just as you pointed out missed the point of the Graduate! Where as Summer was pretty much anti-love, anti-relationships because her parents divorced when she was young! This totally went over my head the first time but after re-watching it yes you are totally correct. So here we have JGL the stereotypical feminine influences sad love songs, rom movies, and then we have Summer being more so a stereotypical dude being a child from a broken family who's like F love, all she cared about was her black hair chopping it off and it growing back just as fast. So yeah you absolutely nailed this!

I didn't actually think of that. That the stereotypical gender traits were reversed, good point. I think it was kind of in the back of my mind but I didn't really think of it.

As for the last 5 minutes of the movie I saw the tail end of JGL sitting on the bench and then as Summer walks away he says I truly hope you are happy. This shows that JGL is a decent person and really does seem sincere and wants the best for her even if its not with him as much as it hurts him. That is pretty deep. But again it shows that JGL was not toxic, not a stalker, he wasn't even aggressive or assertive with her!

Yeah, it does make me sad that people are combing through older films trying to look at them in a new light in order to tear them down and make everything seem sinister and outdated. So it makes you feel bad for enjoying them. Makes you wonder what film they'll target next. I would never have expected 500 Days of Summer.

I'm also going to give my honest blunt opinion and say Autumn's waaaaay hotter than Summer! I mean Zoey is attractive, more so cute than anything but DAMN Autumn's way smoking hot! I took this as an absolute UPGRADE!

She's definitely hot, but personally I thought she was a bit of a bland hot. I think ZD looks more unique and down to earth. So I'd say she's probably more my type. Though don't get me wrong, I wouldn't complain about either.

One of my uncles was this way. He married a really hot woman(my aunt through marriage) and like once she hit like late 30's she said F this I want the good life and just left him was already dating around a few ballers who in her karma turned out to be fake ballers pretending to be millionaires when they were not even wealthy or successful at all. My uncle was destroyed turned to alcohol as you pointed out even ended up in prison with a DUI. It took him about 10 years to bounce back. At his lowest point when he had nothing his business was on the brink of closing he had to pay her alimony per month even though she was the one who cheated on him and was dating other men and she was making more money than he was doing some high level sales job. She was driving the brand new BMW 7 series and wearing like $10,000.00 dresses and had a mansion up on the hills and he had nothing. So yeah exactly like you explained!

Shit, doesn't sound like your uncle has had a very good time.

But what advice do you have for those 2 guys I mentioned who NEVER even got started and never even tried to meet chicks? Is it a lost cause? I pretty much gave up on them years ago as I tried like hell to help them(I did everything from being their best wingman, inviting them to parties, concerts, trips, Vegas, happy hour, etc etc.) as most of our mutual friends all gave up on them like 10 years ago. I always wondered how they would end up, but it seems pretty obvious how things will end for them since they NEVER tried and have no desire to even attempt to try.

Internet dating maybe? It's a lot easier to send a stranger a message than it is to approach them in a crowded room full of people. Even that would probably be hard. I hear women get far far more opportunities on there than men, as you would expect. But it would vastly lower the awkwardness of approaching someone.

I couldn't tell you if it's a lost cause or not but from what your saying it doesn't sound good. Women are attracted to challenge. If it's easy for them to get someone then they probably won't see that person as worth it. And these guys your talking about don't sound like they'll be on their radar. They'd probably have to meet someone in the same boat as them. The problem is there is going to be a lot more men in that situation than women. So it would be hard for that situation to arise.

@JustinJackFlash said:

@MrCharmingMan said:

First off this movie was really good in hindsight, I must have been 1/2 awake or drunk or only partially focused on the movie when I watched it. You were absolutely correct it said JGL was raised on "SAD British Pop music" and just as you pointed out missed the point of the Graduate! Where as Summer was pretty much anti-love, anti-relationships because her parents divorced when she was young! This totally went over my head the first time but after re-watching it yes you are totally correct. So here we have JGL the stereotypical feminine influences sad love songs, rom movies, and then we have Summer being more so a stereotypical dude being a child from a broken family who's like F love, all she cared about was her black hair chopping it off and it growing back just as fast. So yeah you absolutely nailed this!

I didn't actually think of that. That the stereotypical gender traits were reversed, good point. I think it was kind of in the back of my mind but I didn't really think of it.

As for the last 5 minutes of the movie I saw the tail end of JGL sitting on the bench and then as Summer walks away he says I truly hope you are happy. This shows that JGL is a decent person and really does seem sincere and wants the best for her even if its not with him as much as it hurts him. That is pretty deep. But again it shows that JGL was not toxic, not a stalker, he wasn't even aggressive or assertive with her!

Yeah, it does make me sad that people are combing through older films trying to look at them in a new light in order to tear them down and make everything seem sinister and outdated. So it makes you feel bad for enjoying them. Makes you wonder what film they'll target next. I would never have expected 500 Days of Summer.

I'm also going to give my honest blunt opinion and say Autumn's waaaaay hotter than Summer! I mean Zoey is attractive, more so cute than anything but DAMN Autumn's way smoking hot! I took this as an absolute UPGRADE!

She's definitely hot, but personally I thought she was a bit of a bland hot. I think ZD looks more unique and down to earth. So I'd say she's probably more my type. Though don't get me wrong, I wouldn't complain about either.

One of my uncles was this way. He married a really hot woman(my aunt through marriage) and like once she hit like late 30's she said F this I want the good life and just left him was already dating around a few ballers who in her karma turned out to be fake ballers pretending to be millionaires when they were not even wealthy or successful at all. My uncle was destroyed turned to alcohol as you pointed out even ended up in prison with a DUI. It took him about 10 years to bounce back. At his lowest point when he had nothing his business was on the brink of closing he had to pay her alimony per month even though she was the one who cheated on him and was dating other men and she was making more money than he was doing some high level sales job. She was driving the brand new BMW 7 series and wearing like $10,000.00 dresses and had a mansion up on the hills and he had nothing. So yeah exactly like you explained!

Shit, doesn't sound like your uncle has had a very good time.

But what advice do you have for those 2 guys I mentioned who NEVER even got started and never even tried to meet chicks? Is it a lost cause? I pretty much gave up on them years ago as I tried like hell to help them(I did everything from being their best wingman, inviting them to parties, concerts, trips, Vegas, happy hour, etc etc.) as most of our mutual friends all gave up on them like 10 years ago. I always wondered how they would end up, but it seems pretty obvious how things will end for them since they NEVER tried and have no desire to even attempt to try.

Internet dating maybe? It's a lot easier to send a stranger a message than it is to approach them in a crowded room full of people. Even that would probably be hard. I hear women get far far more opportunities on there than men, as you would expect. But it would vastly lower the awkwardness of approaching someone.

I couldn't tell you if it's a lost cause or not but from what your saying it doesn't sound good. Women are attracted to challenge. If it's easy for them to get someone then they probably won't see that person as worth it. And these guys your talking about don't sound like they'll be on their radar. They'd probably have to meet someone in the same boat as them. The problem is there is going to be a lot more men in that situation than women. So it would be hard for that situation to arise.

Yeah bro I get what your saying that Autumn was a bland hot verses a smoking hot, but again it was for an architecture firm interview right? Its not like she's gonna have her DD's poppin out of her tube top and J-Lo booty sticking out of her her spandex shorts lol. I actually think women are all for the most part bland when in corporate work place attire. I mean they are pretty much in suits and pant suits right??? Not exactly the best attire to show off the curves and goodies right?

The Summer character also reminds me of this similar hipster, punk chick who I knew in high school. She hated anything that was popular or famous, and only liked very obscure, indie crap that no ones ever heard of. She kinda did that on purpose as if it was cool to her to only know the indie unknown bands, movies, music, clothes that only she liked and even knew of. Then when it came time for us all to graduate HS, I was like hey Flo where you going to college next year? She then tells me some small unknown secret college that no ones ever heard of in Colorado that doesn't believe in big classes so the classes are all under 10 people at maximum, and they don't believe in desks, so everyone's sitting on weird like couches in a circle so everyones equal. There was some other very strange things about this unknown indie college that no ones ever heard of too. But now this many years later you have to wonder was that college even an accredited college? LOL. Also how did this chick Flo end up? She hated all things loved by the masses, that was popular or famous so that means shes probably a broke starving artist somewhere living with other broke starving artists right? Another example was Margo in Paper Towns. Have you seen that one??? If not I won't go into as I'd hate to talk spoilers.

Yeah my uncle hit rock bottom almost verbatim as you described, its pretty amazing how you pretty much nailed what exactly happened to him. Its also interesting too now that we have Uber and Lyft, one can simply avoid getting a DUI and going to jail just by clicking a few buttons on their iPhone where back then my uncle and a ton of people all got DUI just cuz they are trying to drown their sorrows as you pointed out. The important thing about my uncle was that he did turn things around. About a decade later he became rather successful one of his final businesses finally turned out to be a big success and he made a few million dollars, but one thing he should have done was quit while he was ahead because he opened multiple small businesses and tried to expand to quickly and initially for the first 4 years he was killing it, but then eventually he got too saturated, and that might have even been because he himself expanded so fast? The pandemic was the big blow that really hurt them, but yeah I think we all got hit hard from the pandemic. But again the more positive point was that he did turn things around and for a good 5 to 6 years he was even making a few million so had his first wife just waited even like another 7 years then she would have been able to also experience all that success as she was supposed to the right way.

As for the 2 Lost Causes, I pretty much had to cut them off. First at around age 35, and then I tried to really throw a hail marry pass when they were closing in on 40, but after they hit 40 I said F this, NO MORE! I wasted way too much time, blood, sweat, tears and even a ton of my own money trying to help them. Because I really did care for them. But at a certain point you must cut people off if all they do is bring you down or hold you down or in their cases never even try to better themselves. It is also another form of toxic even tho they are pretty much just doing it to themselves. As you pointed out we highly suggested and motivated them to try internet dating and all they kept saying was all these weirdos are online. I dont think it was a genuine reason and more so another weak excuse to prolong really giving it an honest go. I even scored us some very expensive hard to obtain Comic Con passes since thats more so up their alley and safe zone right as you suggested. So I ended up dropping like $1000 on the comic con passes and another $900 on the hotel since it was like $350 a night all for them and what do they do? They flake out last second with no apology or decent explanation and so I end up spending like $2,000 for them just to p*ss out in the 12th hour. Needless to say this happened at least a dozen times so I literally lost a ton of money trying to help them too. Which is all the more reason I had to cut them off when they finally reached age 40.

Most of, well ALL of our mutual friends all gave up on them and a lot even wonder why I continue being their friends. I'm just loyal and have a big heart, but yeah I pretty much had to cut them off when they hit 40, cuz that was just the final straw as I saw I wasted way too much time, energy, blood, sweat, tears, and money trying to help those lost causes!

With this pandemic destroying everyones social life for the last 2 years, it is now even 100times worse for them as you can imagine.

But again thanks for your great insight, thoughts, and help on the interesting topics. I appreciate your input and contributions to this thread friend!

@MrCharmingMan said:

Yeah bro I get what your saying that Autumn was a bland hot verses a smoking hot, but again it was for an architecture firm interview right? Its not like she's gonna have her DD's poppin out of her tube top and J-Lo booty sticking out of her her spandex shorts lol. I actually think women are all for the most part bland when in corporate work place attire. I mean they are pretty much in suits and pant suits right??? Not exactly the best attire to show off the curves and goodies right?

Lol, prob not quite what I meant when I said bland. I meant just her face. Nothing to do with her attire. She is definitely hot, but she kind of looks like a typical model to me. Her face didn't look interesting or unique. Like the kind of hot girl clone you see in films all the time. That whole model type wouldn't be my personal preference. Remember, Summer wasn't swinging her tits about either.

Yeah my uncle hit rock bottom almost verbatim as you described, its pretty amazing how you pretty much nailed what exactly happened to him. Its also interesting too now that we have Uber and Lyft, one can simply avoid getting a DUI and going to jail just by clicking a few buttons on their iPhone where back then my uncle and a ton of people all got DUI just cuz they are trying to drown their sorrows as you pointed out. The important thing about my uncle was that he did turn things around. About a decade later he became rather successful one of his final businesses finally turned out to be a big success and he made a few million dollars, but one thing he should have done was quit while he was ahead because he opened multiple small businesses and tried to expand to quickly and initially for the first 4 years he was killing it, but then eventually he got too saturated, and that might have even been because he himself expanded so fast? The pandemic was the big blow that really hurt them, but yeah I think we all got hit hard from the pandemic. But again the more positive point was that he did turn things around and for a good 5 to 6 years he was even making a few million so had his first wife just waited even like another 7 years then she would have been able to also experience all that success as she was supposed to the right way.

Jesus? A few million? That's quite the turn around. Well, it's good to hear things went well for him. At least for a while.

As for the 2 Lost Causes, I pretty much had to cut them off. First at around age 35, and then I tried to really throw a hail marry pass when they were closing in on 40, but after they hit 40 I said F this, NO MORE! I wasted way too much time, blood, sweat, tears and even a ton of my own money trying to help them. Because I really did care for them. But at a certain point you must cut people off if all they do is bring you down or hold you down or in their cases never even try to better themselves. It is also another form of toxic even tho they are pretty much just doing it to themselves. As you pointed out we highly suggested and motivated them to try internet dating and all they kept saying was all these weirdos are online. I dont think it was a genuine reason and more so another weak excuse to prolong really giving it an honest go. I even scored us some very expensive hard to obtain Comic Con passes since thats more so up their alley and safe zone right as you suggested. So I ended up dropping like $1000 on the comic con passes and another $900 on the hotel since it was like $350 a night all for them and what do they do? They flake out last second with no apology or decent explanation and so I end up spending like $2,000 for them just to p*ss out in the 12th hour. Needless to say this happened at least a dozen times so I literally lost a ton of money trying to help them too. Which is all the more reason I had to cut them off when they finally reached age 40.

Most of, well ALL of our mutual friends all gave up on them and a lot even wonder why I continue being their friends. I'm just loyal and have a big heart, but yeah I pretty much had to cut them off when they hit 40, cuz that was just the final straw as I saw I wasted way too much time, energy, blood, sweat, tears, and money trying to help those lost causes!

With this pandemic destroying everyones social life for the last 2 years, it is now even 100times worse for them as you can imagine.

That is a hell of a lot of money to spend on them, dude. That must have been frustrating. But do they talk to you about how they feel about their position? I mean, do they often bemoan their lack of experience with women? Do they tend to complain that they don't have one in their lives and can't get one? Or are they generally silent on the matter? Because it could be that, however unhappy they might be with their plight, they may have accepted it. And they have no intention of wrestling with it.

Do they actually ask you for help? Because, however you may care for them and want the best for them, it isn't your responsibility. You've tried to help them, you've done your bit. Maybe now it's time, if they've accepted how things are for themselves, for you to accept them for who they are too and just enjoy their company, just enjoy being friends. As you said, they are a lost cause. And it's up to them if they want to try to change things. The balls in their court and they have to make the decision to change and put in the effort. If they just want to settle with the way things are then it's probably going to be very hard to change that.

But again thanks for your great insight, thoughts, and help on the interesting topics. I appreciate your input and contributions to this thread friend!

Thanks for bringing up an interesting topic.

@JustinJackFlash said:

@MrCharmingMan said:

Yeah bro I get what your saying that Autumn was a bland hot verses a smoking hot, but again it was for an architecture firm interview right? Its not like she's gonna have her DD's poppin out of her tube top and J-Lo booty sticking out of her her spandex shorts lol. I actually think women are all for the most part bland when in corporate work place attire. I mean they are pretty much in suits and pant suits right??? Not exactly the best attire to show off the curves and goodies right?

Lol, prob not quite what I meant when I said bland. I meant just her face. Nothing to do with her attire. She is definitely hot, but she kind of looks like a typical model to me. Her face didn't look interesting or unique. Like the kind of hot girl clone you see in films all the time. That whole model type wouldn't be my personal preference. Remember, Summer wasn't swinging her tits about either.

Yeah my uncle hit rock bottom almost verbatim as you described, its pretty amazing how you pretty much nailed what exactly happened to him. Its also interesting too now that we have Uber and Lyft, one can simply avoid getting a DUI and going to jail just by clicking a few buttons on their iPhone where back then my uncle and a ton of people all got DUI just cuz they are trying to drown their sorrows as you pointed out. The important thing about my uncle was that he did turn things around. About a decade later he became rather successful one of his final businesses finally turned out to be a big success and he made a few million dollars, but one thing he should have done was quit while he was ahead because he opened multiple small businesses and tried to expand to quickly and initially for the first 4 years he was killing it, but then eventually he got too saturated, and that might have even been because he himself expanded so fast? The pandemic was the big blow that really hurt them, but yeah I think we all got hit hard from the pandemic. But again the more positive point was that he did turn things around and for a good 5 to 6 years he was even making a few million so had his first wife just waited even like another 7 years then she would have been able to also experience all that success as she was supposed to the right way.

Jesus? A few million? That's quite the turn around. Well, it's good to hear things went well for him. At least for a while.

As for the 2 Lost Causes, I pretty much had to cut them off. First at around age 35, and then I tried to really throw a hail marry pass when they were closing in on 40, but after they hit 40 I said F this, NO MORE! I wasted way too much time, blood, sweat, tears and even a ton of my own money trying to help them. Because I really did care for them. But at a certain point you must cut people off if all they do is bring you down or hold you down or in their cases never even try to better themselves. It is also another form of toxic even tho they are pretty much just doing it to themselves. As you pointed out we highly suggested and motivated them to try internet dating and all they kept saying was all these weirdos are online. I dont think it was a genuine reason and more so another weak excuse to prolong really giving it an honest go. I even scored us some very expensive hard to obtain Comic Con passes since thats more so up their alley and safe zone right as you suggested. So I ended up dropping like $1000 on the comic con passes and another $900 on the hotel since it was like $350 a night all for them and what do they do? They flake out last second with no apology or decent explanation and so I end up spending like $2,000 for them just to p*ss out in the 12th hour. Needless to say this happened at least a dozen times so I literally lost a ton of money trying to help them too. Which is all the more reason I had to cut them off when they finally reached age 40.

Most of, well ALL of our mutual friends all gave up on them and a lot even wonder why I continue being their friends. I'm just loyal and have a big heart, but yeah I pretty much had to cut them off when they hit 40, cuz that was just the final straw as I saw I wasted way too much time, energy, blood, sweat, tears, and money trying to help those lost causes!

With this pandemic destroying everyones social life for the last 2 years, it is now even 100times worse for them as you can imagine.

That is a hell of a lot of money to spend on them, dude. That must have been frustrating. But do they talk to you about how they feel about their position? I mean, do they often bemoan their lack of experience with women? Do they tend to complain that they don't have one in their lives and can't get one? Or are they generally silent on the matter? Because it could be that, however unhappy they might be with their plight, they may have accepted it. And they have no intention of wrestling with it.

Do they actually ask you for help? Because, however you may care for them and want the best for them, it isn't your responsibility. You've tried to help them, you've done your bit. Maybe now it's time, if they've accepted how things are for themselves, for you to accept them for who they are too and just enjoy their company, just enjoy being friends. As you said, they are a lost cause. And it's up to them if they want to try to change things. The balls in their court and they have to make the decision to change and put in the effort. If they just want to settle with the way things are then it's probably going to be very hard to change that.

But again thanks for your great insight, thoughts, and help on the interesting topics. I appreciate your input and contributions to this thread friend!

Thanks for bringing up an interesting topic.

Yeah I kinda was being a bit goofy with my response to the Bland comment. But I think women are not at their best in an uptight corporate environment, even at the gym in yoga pants you see some incredible inspiration! I never thought Summer/Zoey was ever really hot. Cute yes, but not really my cup of tea and I do prefer brunettes over blonde even. I just feel she was always a bit plain, but she had a cool like nostalgic vibe to her that was original. It makes you wonder how old is Zoey she was playing an adult in Almost Famous and that movie came out in 2000! Wow shes only 41? I thought she was much older. Yeah no shes definitely cute and attractive but I just rather hook up with Autumn in this particular situation. I'll even say that Katy Perry is pretty much similar in looks to Zoey in that they both have big dark hair and pretty eyes and faces but Katy has the huge jugs of joy and thus is like 10times hotter than Zoey.

Yeah he definitely came up a few million at the height of his latest business but here in California a few million does not go a long way as it does in most other states. A decent home here in a decent neighborhood without crackheads and gangs running around easily goes for 1.5 million to 2million alone and I'm being very basic and conservative with that price. Where as other states right next to us in Arizona, Nevada, etc. you can get a sweet huge mansion in the best neighborhood for 1/2 that! It sucks to live here in terms of the cons of cost of living, taxes, etc. I'm not sure what state you live in bro? Also the key lesson in his success was he expanded too quickly and spread himself out too thin and got saturated fast! So in the beginning like the first 4 years he was killing it but like any hot business here in California you are lucky to even get a 4 year run as most people here are not loyal and will shop at the next new thing in a heartbeat just cause its the new thing. That's mostly how LA and Southern California is, zero loyalty, culture and community, sadly. There was also a study that showed you need at least 2 million just to retire here in California as it breaks down to like under 70K a year which is needed to survive here in Cali! But yeah had she stook by him just like 7 more years she would have been part of all that success he had, but she didn't want to wait, hence going back to your explanation of how when women want a divorce they pretty much just upgrade and the men are just completely destroyed and all the other things you mentioned!

Yeah bro as for the LostCauses many have pretty much said the same thing you said in that, if they never expressed their personal issues with me or asked me for help , then its on them. I just know with their personality they would never ask for help or admit how they really feel. Many have said they act and say they are ok but deep down inside who the hell doesn't want a companion, a hot fun cool chick to spend time with, date, live with? I mean lets be 100% REAL on this, no one wants to "pitch a tent" 24/7 and that be their only form of sexual experience and activity ever! Never even knowing the god damn touch and feel of a woman at all! I mean just think if you and I were in their shoes, I know I'd probably end up in jail! LOL

Some even attacked me for making them confront their issues as if I was the bad guy like WHAT??? But in the end I just had to give a deadline with them as I can't just keep wasting all my time, sweat, tears, blood, and money to help them. The reason why I explained to you how much I spent on them was to show you how hard and sincere/passionate I was in really trying to help them and turn their lives around. I knew if the shoe was on the other foot I'd be immensely grateful that a close friend would do the same for me(even though no one ever did, and I didn't really need it, thankfully). Also just as you stated many said just accept them for their flaws and just enjoy hanging out with them. This is one of the reasons why they do still make good friends because they are always able to hang out whenever I am in their neck of the woods, since they have no families, no kids, no wives, no girlfriends where pretty much most of our other friends all have gone MIA since they all have kids, families that dominant all of their free time.

I actually wanted to try to private message you or email you more on their issue but I guess we are not able to message each other on this site? I thought we were? Maybe I'm mixing this site up with another forum where you can message each other?

Did you ever see Paper Towns btw? I felt Margo in Paper Towns was a lot like Summer in 500 Days of Summer, but I didnt want to elaborate in case you never seen Paper Towns yet? Also didn't wanna post spoilers of that movie on here for those who haven't seen it yet. But basically I felt Margo was like Summer at a younger age and most criticized Margo for how she realistically would end up since she too had the carefree, indie, no responsibility mentality as well, maybe even more extreme than Summer did as we actually see how Summer ended up.

@MrCharmingMan said:

Yeah I kinda was being a bit goofy with my response to the Bland comment. But I think women are not at their best in an uptight corporate environment, even at the gym in yoga pants you see some incredible inspiration! I never thought Summer/Zoey was ever really hot. Cute yes, but not really my cup of tea and I do prefer brunettes over blonde even. I just feel she was always a bit plain, but she had a cool like nostalgic vibe to her that was original. It makes you wonder how old is Zoey she was playing an adult in Almost Famous and that movie came out in 2000! Wow shes only 41? I thought she was much older. Yeah no shes definitely cute and attractive but I just rather hook up with Autumn in this particular situation. I'll even say that Katy Perry is pretty much similar in looks to Zoey in that they both have big dark hair and pretty eyes and faces but Katy has the huge jugs of joy and thus is like 10times hotter than Zoey.

Yeah, Katy Perry is definitely hotter than both of them. Good call.

Yeah he definitely came up a few million at the height of his latest business but here in California a few million does not go a long way as it does in most other states. A decent home here in a decent neighborhood without crackheads and gangs running around easily goes for 1.5 million to 2million alone and I'm being very basic and conservative with that price. Where as other states right next to us in Arizona, Nevada, etc. you can get a sweet huge mansion in the best neighborhood for 1/2 that! It sucks to live here in terms of the cons of cost of living, taxes, etc. I'm not sure what state you live in bro?

I live in the UK so we don't have states. I'm from Newport in South Wales. So nothing like California which may be expensive but is probably a great place to live with lots going on everywhere you look. Here it pretty much sucks, very basic.

Yeah bro as for the LostCauses many have pretty much said the same thing you said in that, if they never expressed their personal issues with me or asked me for help , then its on them. I just know with their personality they would never ask for help or admit how they really feel. Many have said they act and say they are ok but deep down inside who the hell doesn't want a companion, a hot fun cool chick to spend time with, date, live with? I mean lets be 100% REAL on this, no one wants to "pitch a tent" 24/7 and that be their only form of sexual experience and activity ever! Never even knowing the god damn touch and feel of a woman at all! I mean just think if you and I were in their shoes, I know I'd probably end up in jail! LOL

I can't imagine what that would be like at 40. Going all those years without any sexual experience. I would guess it would play it's biggest part on their confidence and sense of self worth. You'd be left out of a lot of conversations. Again, it's something that tends to only happen to men. You don't hear of many women that age who have never had any experience with the opposite sex whatsoever. They exist but they are few and far between. Alas, many men are dealt that hand.

Did you ever see Paper Towns btw? I felt Margo in Paper Towns was a lot like Summer in 500 Days of Summer, but I didnt want to elaborate in case you never seen Paper Towns yet? Also didn't wanna post spoilers of that movie on here for those who haven't seen it yet. But basically I felt Margo was like Summer at a younger age and most criticized Margo for how she realistically would end up since she too had the carefree, indie, no responsibility mentality as well, maybe even more extreme than Summer did as we actually see how Summer ended up.

No, I haven't seen it but I know the film you're talking about. Is it worth watching?

@JustinJackFlash said:

@MrCharmingMan said:

Yeah I kinda was being a bit goofy with my response to the Bland comment. But I think women are not at their best in an uptight corporate environment, even at the gym in yoga pants you see some incredible inspiration! I never thought Summer/Zoey was ever really hot. Cute yes, but not really my cup of tea and I do prefer brunettes over blonde even. I just feel she was always a bit plain, but she had a cool like nostalgic vibe to her that was original. It makes you wonder how old is Zoey she was playing an adult in Almost Famous and that movie came out in 2000! Wow shes only 41? I thought she was much older. Yeah no shes definitely cute and attractive but I just rather hook up with Autumn in this particular situation. I'll even say that Katy Perry is pretty much similar in looks to Zoey in that they both have big dark hair and pretty eyes and faces but Katy has the huge jugs of joy and thus is like 10times hotter than Zoey.

Yeah, Katy Perry is definitely hotter than both of them. Good call.

Yeah he definitely came up a few million at the height of his latest business but here in California a few million does not go a long way as it does in most other states. A decent home here in a decent neighborhood without crackheads and gangs running around easily goes for 1.5 million to 2million alone and I'm being very basic and conservative with that price. Where as other states right next to us in Arizona, Nevada, etc. you can get a sweet huge mansion in the best neighborhood for 1/2 that! It sucks to live here in terms of the cons of cost of living, taxes, etc. I'm not sure what state you live in bro?

I live in the UK so we don't have states. I'm from Newport in South Wales. So nothing like California which may be expensive but is probably a great place to live with lots going on everywhere you look. Here it pretty much sucks, very basic.

Yeah bro as for the LostCauses many have pretty much said the same thing you said in that, if they never expressed their personal issues with me or asked me for help , then its on them. I just know with their personality they would never ask for help or admit how they really feel. Many have said they act and say they are ok but deep down inside who the hell doesn't want a companion, a hot fun cool chick to spend time with, date, live with? I mean lets be 100% REAL on this, no one wants to "pitch a tent" 24/7 and that be their only form of sexual experience and activity ever! Never even knowing the god damn touch and feel of a woman at all! I mean just think if you and I were in their shoes, I know I'd probably end up in jail! LOL

I can't imagine what that would be like at 40. Going all those years without any sexual experience. I would guess it would play it's biggest part on their confidence and sense of self worth. You'd be left out of a lot of conversations. Again, it's something that tends to only happen to men. You don't hear of many women that age who have never had any experience with the opposite sex whatsoever. They exist but they are few and far between. Alas, many men are dealt that hand.

Did you ever see Paper Towns btw? I felt Margo in Paper Towns was a lot like Summer in 500 Days of Summer, but I didnt want to elaborate in case you never seen Paper Towns yet? Also didn't wanna post spoilers of that movie on here for those who haven't seen it yet. But basically I felt Margo was like Summer at a younger age and most criticized Margo for how she realistically would end up since she too had the carefree, indie, no responsibility mentality as well, maybe even more extreme than Summer did as we actually see how Summer ended up.

No, I haven't seen it but I know the film you're talking about. Is it worth watching?

Oh awesome, that was pretty ignorant of me to assume you were also an American living stateside. Yes I think off the top of my head Wales always reminds me of the boxer Joe Calzaghe he was an undefeated SuperMiddleweight champion who just threw like a ton of punches nonstop for like 12 rounds straight. I've never seen a fighter who just let his hands go nonstop and his opponents just gave up and got outworked and overwhelmed. I wonder where all his stamina came from and why I never seen another fighter do what he was able to do. Also he retired fairly early where most fighters keep fighting on and take losses and lose all their money. But yeah California is a beautiful place, the weather is probably the best in the world, but pretty much everything else sucks here. Even if you were making like 1 or 2 million a year you are pretty much just slightly making it here. I dont get why more people just leave. During the pandemic a ton of people left California for Arizona, Texas, and Nevada. Personally I'd love to relocate to Florida by Disney World but yeah Florida has their issues as well. I'm sure you heard about all the drama about the "Florida Man" right? But that same one million or two million in Florida you would be living like a king! You can get a sweet mansion in Florida for like $600,000!

As for the LostCauses, yeah I just dont get it. I mean at the very least dont these guys want to at least finally get laid and lose their virginity? I mean at the very least go to third base or even second base, shoot these guys never even kissed a girl before! I remember when I was in my late teens and 20's I dont think I could go for more than 3 months without any form of sexual activity and I couldn't imagine going 40 years of never doing anything. I'd lose my mind and definitely end up in jail LOL. I just had to give up on them after trying so damn hard I had to give a deadline to cut them off. Some of our mutual friends joke that I'll return to try to help them right before their 50th bday, but no I am DONE!

Yes Paper Towns is definitely worth watching. It has a very over all similar plot and story to 500DaysOfSummer but more so at a younger age. They were all seniors in high school in the movie. Both Margo and Summer are pretty much the same type of girl in that they are very unconventional, very complex, very mysterious, and I would even say Margo in PaperTowns was probably how Summer was in high school or before she was in the movie 500DaysofSummer. I'd like to know your thoughts on the movie after you get a chance to see it.

Another movie I saw that surprisingly turned out to be real good/funny was Love Hard on Netflix. It pretty much makes fun of all the classic Christmas Rom Com movies (Love Actually) and was done in a very clever and even original way, and the reason I bring it up is because the main actress in this movie is somewhat like Summer as that shes all anti-relationships and even purposely goes on several dates to write about how bad the dates went and whats wrong with dating in today's world. I think her character is actually really honest in what a girl who's keeping it REAL is really thinking and wanting at that age. If anything its kind of like what 500DaysOfSummer would be in todays climate post MeToo etc. I would be interested in seeing your thoughts on that movie as well if you get a chance.

Hey buddy how bad is the covid situation over there by you? Are the cases rising up again? Are you guys locking down? It seems we here in the USA are always behind you guys by a few months or so. I hope all is well. Cheers!