What a change in Klaus from the pilot episode. When he first learned that Hayley was pregnant with his child he said he was willing to see them both dead. Now he is possessed of a father's love. He wants nothing more than to save his daughter.

I believe that "always and forever" will be restored to all the siblings, and that their love for Hope will somehow be their salvation. I suspect they will sacrifice themselves to save her and their friends. I am guessing that somehow that will happen.

I want Elijah to die a very slow & painful death! I have never really liked Elijah (too stuffy) but he's important to Klaus so I tolerated him. But Elijah knows who he is & he still let Haley die.

I think that when he let Hayley die his memories of his family were still blocked. He said he had studied the history of the family and knew that he had tried to save Klaus from himself over and over, but he had no actual memory of it. He knew he was never able to keep Klaus from daggering Rebecca in the coffin for centuries at a time, or sabotaging their chances at a relatively tranquil life, etc. and figured that it wasn't worth trying to help him. So he had no memory of his feelings for Hayley or his family at that time of the fight. He thought he was fighting to save his girlfriend's mother (not knowing what a bitch she really was). He was whipped. He was deluded.

But I get what you're saying. He had a theoretical knowledge of her importance and he chose the wrong side in that fight. And he does have a stiff, somewhat stuck up way of talking. He often sounds like he is putting on an affectation of sophistication.

In retrospect it was a huge mistake for Marcel to wipe his memories completely. He should have compelled him to have the strength to deal with it, not to wipe out his memories completely that way.

I think it's interesting that Klaus said he refused to save Elijah's new girl in return for Elijah taking his memories back because he was afraid it would destroy Elijah to remember. He said that if he realized what he had done, if he realized he had indirectly caused Hayley's death, and remembered his feelings for her, it would break his mind and destroy him. That shows the good side of Klaus that we rarely see. For all his bluster he really does care for his siblings. And it shows how perceptive he is. He was correct that Elijah would be crushed by guilt if he got his memories back. When Elijah agreed to have the compulsion reversed, he could not stand what he was starting to remember. People lose consciousness when they feel too much pain, and Elijah passed out from the pain of just getting close to the red door. The memory of his betrayal of Klaus when they were young was too much for him.

I think the writing is good. Although I have a hunch about how things will generally work out, there is no way to predict how it really will, or what twists the story will take getting there.

As it stands now it looks like Marcel and Vincent are probably going to let that girl die from Klaus's bite since Elijah passed out before going all the way through with the memory restoration. If that happens, Elijah is going to be so pissed off he is going to go to war with Klaus and company. In the short term I bet we will see that. I doubt he will die though, at least not from the war.

I think they will all either 1- sacrifice themselves in order to save Hope, or 2- maybe there will be some way that the Originals become human again and live mortal lives and die.

I like these vampire shows. There is something very appealing thinking about living for centuries as a man in his mid 20s in excellent health. I love history and would be able to live through it. I could become an expert in many areas, develop superior skills while retaining strength and energy of youth, etc. Of course, having to live on the blood of innocent people is a deal breaker. (I suppose I could run a blood bank and just "eat" that way. ) I think I would miss having a good steak, ice cream, etc.

Elijah's guilt (& his true self) are behind the 'red door'. I saw this review of 'Red Door' season 2, episode 5 (from Nov. 2014, there is more) on another site when I was looking up stuff:

"With what may be the best Originals episode to date, it seems the Mikaelson family still has many secrets, and like any good gothic story, one of them is hidden away in a secret room. Elijah’s horrible crimes (particularly his first) are locked away behind the red door, a symbol in his mind of all the crimes he has committed. His suit is a shield protecting him from the truth of his own monstrosities. If he looks like a gentleman, maybe he’ll believe he actually is one."

This pretty much sums up Elijah for me. Klaus was my favorite from the beginning, I can't really articulate (old brain) the reasons, so...

I didn't watch TVD, it was too teen-centric. I didn't catch TO until the second episode of season one, I decided to watch because it seemed mostly skewed towards an adult audience.

@bratface said:

Elijah's guilt (& his true self) are behind the 'red door'. I saw this review of 'Red Door' season 2, episode 5 (from Nov. 2014, there is more) on another site when I was looking up stuff:

"With what may be the best Originals episode to date, it seems the Mikaelson family still has many secrets, and like any good gothic story, one of them is hidden away in a secret room. Elijah’s horrible crimes (particularly his first) are locked away behind the red door, a symbol in his mind of all the crimes he has committed. His suit is a shield protecting him from the truth of his own monstrosities. If he looks like a gentleman, maybe he’ll believe he actually is one."

This pretty much sums up Elijah for me. Klaus was my favorite from the beginning, I can't really articulate (old brain) the reasons, so...

I didn't watch TVD, it was too teen-centric. I didn't catch TO until the second episode of season one, I decided to watch because it seemed mostly skewed towards an adult audience.

I like that summary of Elijah and the red door. It is congruent with what I recall from those episodes. As I recall, their mother kind of compelled Elijah into locking away the memories of his early horrible acts, like killing a girl he and Klaus both liked when he had not yet learned to control his hunger. Elijah was horrified at what he had done and was totally overcome with grief at his own actions. So she wiped his memory. Mother took the blame for killing the girl. I guess she helped Elijah create this image of himself as a gentleman, which helps him to mostly behave that way.

When she returned, trying to convince her vampire children to let her turn them into mortals, she showed Elijah what was behind the red door, how monstrous he was as a young man. Actually, all of them are monstrous. We tend to overlook that since it is a fantasy show, and we focus on their interpersonal relationships and their personalities. But they all kill humans for food, and sometimes for sport.

I like Klaus in many ways. I think he overplays his betrayed, injured, victim bit way too much. It's like he keeps the wound open, sensitive, and raw on purpose. He uses it as an excuse for lashing out at whomever he wants to punish or kill. Rebbecca can simply disagree with him and trigger his sense of betrayal which he uses to justify putting a dagger in her chest for decades.
And who the fuck said he could play Daddy and tell her whom she can and cannot date? I am surprised she never found a way to kill him over that a long time ago. If I were a grown woman and a sibling had the gall to try to dictate my social life like that I would not put up with it. So I have issues with Klaus, even though I like him in some ways.

I tried an episode of the vamp diaries also, and like you thought it was angst-driven teenager fare. Not for me. The Originals has less of that kind of drama, and more interesting plots.

@write2topcat said:

@bratface said:

Elijah's guilt (& his true self) are behind the 'red door'. I saw this review of 'Red Door' season 2, episode 5 (from Nov. 2014, there is more) on another site when I was looking up stuff:

"With what may be the best Originals episode to date, it seems the Mikaelson family still has many secrets, and like any good gothic story, one of them is hidden away in a secret room. Elijah’s horrible crimes (particularly his first) are locked away behind the red door, a symbol in his mind of all the crimes he has committed. His suit is a shield protecting him from the truth of his own monstrosities. If he looks like a gentleman, maybe he’ll believe he actually is one."

This pretty much sums up Elijah for me. Klaus was my favorite from the beginning, I can't really articulate (old brain) the reasons, so...

I didn't watch TVD, it was too teen-centric. I didn't catch TO until the second episode of season one, I decided to watch because it seemed mostly skewed towards an adult audience.

I like that summary of Elijah and the red door. It is congruent with what I recall from those episodes. As I recall, their mother kind of compelled Elijah into locking away the memories of his early horrible acts, like killing a girl he and Klaus both liked when he had not yet learned to control his hunger. Elijah was horrified at what he had done and was totally overcome with grief at his own actions. So she wiped his memory. Mother took the blame for killing the girl. I guess she helped Elijah create this image of himself as a gentleman, which helps him to mostly behave that way.

When she returned, trying to convince her vampire children to let her turn them into mortals, she showed Elijah what was behind the red door, how monstrous he was as a young man. Actually, all of them are monstrous. We tend to overlook that since it is a fantasy show, and we focus on their interpersonal relationships and their personalities. But they all kill humans for food, and sometimes for sport.

I like Klaus in many ways. I think he overplays his betrayed, injured, victim bit way too much. It's like he keeps the wound open, sensitive, and raw on purpose. He uses it as an excuse for lashing out at whomever he wants to punish or kill. Rebbecca can simply disagree with him and trigger his sense of betrayal which he uses to justify putting a dagger in her chest for decades.
And who the fuck said he could play Daddy and tell her whom she can and cannot date? I am surprised she never found a way to kill him over that a long time ago. If I were a grown woman and a sibling had the gall to try to dictate my social life like that I would not put up with it. So I have issues with Klaus, even though I like him in some ways.

I tried an episode of the vamp diaries also, and like you thought it was angst-driven teenager fare. Not for me. The Originals has less of that kind of drama, and more interesting plots.

So what did you think of the latest episode 'The Kindness of Strangers '?

Haley had come a long way from where she started on vampire diaries. She was a bit brash and wild and she grew to have self-restraint, powerful but used that power to protect those she loved. She was fair, tough, but still retain a softness to her character. She was as close as an outsider could get to becoming an actual Mikaelson. I loved how she could reason with Klause and make him see things in a different way, but she didn't let him or anyone else push her around. Hayley was just a great character.

I do like Elijah. And I knew once he had his memories back it would destroy him. He deeply loved Hayley, and Hayley had gone through hell and back to protect all of them. I knew he'd remember that final, heartbreaking look she gave him when she realized he wouldn't help her. I hate the way they took Hayley out, she deserved more, but at the same time, it was so Hayley to counter-attack. If she was going out, she was taking the *itch with her lol.

I hate this show is ending, so far this has been its best season for me. Poor hope. She just wanted to see her father and that got her mother killed.

I have to say, Daniel Gillies was amazing. He really sold the grief and guilt and he had me shedding tears when Elijah realized what he'd done. Also, Phoebe Tonkin really sold it in her characters last moments too.

I think he did the right thing walking away from the girlfriend. I mean after what he'd done to Hayley, how can he think of romancing someone else right now? But another thing, I blame her. She KNEW he didn't have his memories and she didn't stop him from going to attack his own family. How did she think that was going to work if he ever remembered? She deserved to lose him in my opinion.

Final thoughts. Is it possible Hope will bring Hayley back by using the powers of the Hollow? The Hollow did bring Davina back and Haley is un-dead. It's not the same as bringing back a live human. I think it could be possible. And Hope is trying to fix things, I don't think she just means Klause and the others. It's her fault her mom got killed. She'd probably want to try to fix that too.

By the way, Hope is getting her own spin-off show. Not sure I'll care for that. I did watch Vampire Diaries but it was more for the teen crowd. I liked The Originals much better as it was aimed at a more mature crowd. It seems like a spin-off for Hope is going back to the teen crowd again.

@bratface said:

@write2topcat said:

@bratface said:

So what did you think of the latest episode 'The Kindness of Strangers '?

I liked it. I have liked this final season a lot so far. It is sort of reviewing the series important relationships as it goes along. I am now rethinking my earlier idea that all the Michaelsons might sacrifice themselves in order to save Hope.

Perhaps Rebbecca and Marcel will finally get together. In this episode she told Marcel she wishes she could have what that old couple on the street has. She wants to have children, and to grow old together with him.
Is Hope going to help her get her wish? Will she turn her mortal so she can live a human life, love, have children, grow old with the man she loves, and finally die? Will all of them have a happy ending? I wonder what that would look like for Elijah. Will Hope bring Hayley back to life? What would make Klaus finally happy and content? Will all of them be made mortal? I think it more likely that all of them will be made mortal than just one of them.

The theme of them as a family, being strongest and at their best when they support and forgive each other was hit again in this episode. Elijah could not open his door. Klaus had to help him, only together could Elijah make it through. Always and forever has been their overriding theme throughout the series. I can't see that changing.

The part of the show I sometimes tired of is the witchcraft aspect. I guess when they faced "the hollow" I got tired of it. I just didn't like anything which was that powerful over them. But I am thinking that Hope might wind up gaining control over that power and using it for good. I wouldn't mind that outcome.

Well there are just a few episodes left now. I am watching Josh die in this episode. I guess they will keep killing them off one by one as they near the series finale. I wonder if Marcel and Rebecca will finally get to hook up without problems?

It sucks when you get involved in a show you like a like and then they decide to end it. I think they should make it illegal to stop making shows I like. LOL

@write2topcat said:

Well there are just a few episodes left now. I am watching Josh die in this episode. I guess they will keep killing them off one by one as they near the series finale. I wonder if Marcel and Rebecca will finally get to hook up without problems?

It sucks when you get involved in a show you like a like and then they decide to end it. I think they should make it illegal to stop making shows I like. LOL

I actually teared up when Vincent was holding Ivy's dead body. Josh dying didn't really bother me, never really liked him. I'm hoping that the only Mikaelson who dies is Elijah.

@bratface said:

@write2topcat said:

Well there are just a few episodes left now. I am watching Josh die in this episode. I guess they will keep killing them off one by one as they near the series finale. I wonder if Marcel and Rebecca will finally get to hook up without problems?

It sucks when you get involved in a show you like a like and then they decide to end it. I think they should make it illegal to stop making shows I like. LOL

I actually teared up when Vincent was holding Ivy's dead body. Josh dying didn't really bother me, never really liked him. I'm hoping that the only Michaelson who dies is Elijah.

I have kind of gotten used to Josh over time. I didn't like the extended scenes of him kissing guys. It just gives me the willies. I don't care if someone is gay or lesbian. But watching two guys get mushy together weirds me out somehow. You know how some people get sick to their stomach if they smell a certain type of food? It's like that.

I am not that moved by any of the characters in the show. I thought Elijah's actor did a good job of acting torn up when he got his memory back and he realized he wasn't there for Hayley. I liked Hayley pretty well.

But mostly I have just enjoyed watching this elaborate story. I have a few stories I follow. Another one just ended, 12 Monkeys. Now The Originals is almost over. I am going to have to find some new ones somewhere.

I wonder if Vincent will find some spell to bring back some of the dead like they did with Klaus' father? Seems like Hope would try to bring Hayley back if it is possible. But then there are only 3 episodes left, so what's the point?

@write2topcat said:

@bratface said:

@write2topcat said:

Well there are just a few episodes left now. I am watching Josh die in this episode. I guess they will keep killing them off one by one as they near the series finale. I wonder if Marcel and Rebecca will finally get to hook up without problems?

It sucks when you get involved in a show you like a like and then they decide to end it. I think they should make it illegal to stop making shows I like. LOL

I actually teared up when Vincent was holding Ivy's dead body. Josh dying didn't really bother me, never really liked him. I'm hoping that the only Michaelson who dies is Elijah.

I have kind of gotten used to Josh over time. I didn't like the extended scenes of him kissing guys. It just gives me the willies. I don't care if someone is gay or lesbian. But watching two guys get mushy together weirds me out somehow. You know how some people get sick to their stomach if they smell a certain type of food? It's like that.

I am not that moved by any of the characters in the show. I thought Elijah's actor did a good job of acting torn up when he got his memory back and he realized he wasn't there for Hayley. I liked Hayley pretty well.

But mostly I have just enjoyed watching this elaborate story. I have a few stories I follow. Another one just ended, 12 Monkeys. Now The Originals is almost over. I am going to have to find some new ones somewhere.

I wonder if Vincent will find some spell to bring back some of the dead like they did with Klaus' father? Seems like Hope would try to bring Hayley back if it is possible. But then there are only 3 episodes left, so what's the point?

I wasn't a huge Hayley fan. I liked her well enough & I realized she was important to the Mikaelson story. But it would be great to have her back so she can kick Elijah's ass.

@bratface said:

I wasn't a huge Hayley fan. I liked her well enough & I realized she was important to the Mikaelson story. But it would be great to have her back so she can kick Elijah's ass.

haha. Yeah I recall you don't care for Elijah too much. lol. Well, pretty soon they will all be gone. Dang it. As much as I sometimes complain about things in these shows I watch, I enjoy watching them. Time to start scoping out the other offerings.

@write2topcat said:

@bratface said:

I wasn't a huge Hayley fan. I liked her well enough & I realized she was important to the Mikaelson story. But it would be great to have her back so she can kick Elijah's ass.

haha. Yeah I recall you don't care for Elijah too much. lol. Well, pretty soon they will all be gone. Dang it. As much as I sometimes complain about things in these shows I watch, I enjoy watching them. Time to start scoping out the other offerings.

I'll miss it too, as I really only have a couple of 'must see' shows(Originals, Supernatural, Elementary). I do watch other shows but if I miss an episode it's no big deal.

They should pass a law that when I like a show they can't cancel it; they can't even take summer breaks. They just have to keep making it until I get tired of it or something. hahahaha