Discuss Star Trek: Enterprise
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The day Star Trek died
posted by Nexus71STAFFMOD on June 13, 2020 at 12:49 PM
On May the 13 th 2005 15 years ago ENT last episode aired with this final adventure of the crew of NX-01 the Star Trek most of us knew and loved died .It's final episode was and is always going to be a point of discussion. One could argue was the whole Riker /Troi part of the story neccesary ? while I don't agree with that assessment and that the focus should have been the crew of NX-01 I do understand what Berman and Braga were aiming at although it didn't come across in the manner they wanted.Also the death of a beloved character (Trip) felt somewhat forced for reason of drama but I feel and many ENT fans with me that the full crew deserved a final moment of glory.Berman&Braga have admitted this episode was a mistake and that their only goal was to celebrate the Trek franchise and the fans it didn't quite worked out the way they intended and they much regret that to this day.I for one respect producers and directors admitting their mistakes(notice Kurtzman and co this is how you approach fans!!)and I appreciate that the intention was coming from the right place.Berman and Braga have been blamed for the demise of Trek in the OO's but over the years as more information about what went on behind the scenes came to light it became appearant that the main causes for the failure of ENT wasn't so much the fault of B&B but franchise fatigue.Which is btw something Berman and Braga had warned CBS of before getting into the production of ENT which they had initially planned to be released 2-3 years after VOY had finished .But CBS demanded more Star Trek(as Flagship for their new UPN channel) aginst the warnings of people with their finger on the fan base pulse.What was the final nail in ENT's coffin was the constant interference from the CBS head office demanding more advanced tech ,time travel and most of the things people criticized ENT for.In hindsight Berman and Braga deserve our respect for managing to diffuse a lot of the crap they had to deal with from people like Lès Moonves (the man who gave us Kurtzman Trek) who according to an interview didn't know anything about Star Trek didn't like Star Trek(because of the previous carte blanche the show had during the Paramount years people in Hollywood can be pretty vindictive)and didn't know a thing about science fiction at all.But as with everything Berman and Braga had to make compromises which seriously undermined their original plans for ENT.But considering the current state Star Trek is in for me Star Trek died with the final scene of the final episode where we get to see the three Enterprises and hear the Three captains which was a lovely gesture by Berman and Braga to the fans.
Reply by Nexus71
on July 1, 2020 at 3:40 PM
Meanwhile back at the OT
Reply by Knixon
on November 2, 2020 at 3:27 PM
I don't know where else to put this to make sure Nex sees it, so here goes...
This is from a site I use a lot, ricochet.com and this particular post is really good.
Binary Choice for Me but Not for Thee Jeff Hawkins By Jeff Hawkins | November 2, 2020 (2 Hours Ago) 23 COMMENTS14 FOLLOW
I blew off some steam a few months back stating I didn’t want to read thought-pieces about “The Conservative Case for Joe Biden” from our commentariat and thought leaders. I need to release a little more steam.
Let me get my biases out of the way: I loathe Joe Biden. I have since my early teens in the late ’80s. The guy who will tell you he’s always smarter than you are, like talking to you is a favor, and yet all of his ideas are dumb, but to him they’re brilliant thinking. I saw a person on the message board I moderate tout Biden’s time on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee as a plus and when asked for one good idea he had, even with googling, he couldn’t come up with one.
The man who will casually slime opposition with accusations of racism or sexism. False modesty only comes out when he wants a vote, then he tells the person in front of him what he or she wants to hear with a personal anecdote of questionable truth to give you that “I’m one of you” feeling. If the next person asks the opposite question, Biden will do the same thing. In fact, 2020 Joe Biden is running against 1993 Biden and because we have the historical recall of a gnat, no one in our media seems to realize it.
We’ve seen the editorials by now: Certain columnists with National Review, Commentary, Dispatch, Bulwark, if you still think they have any morality, the Lincoln Project, Peggy Noonan, George Will, et al., telling you it’s not a binary choice. Vote Biden because he has…something that’s not Trump, which, seems like a binary choice. There’s the occasional “you don’t owe your vote to anyone” contrarian who is voting for someone who can’t win just to posture that he or she is an individual. Oh, that’s cute, you wrote in someone that’s getting as many Electoral Votes as I am, and I’m just as impressed with the person who doesn’t vote because they don’t really have a voice. If I vote for Mickey Mouse, is that a powerful statement or a waste of my responsibility? Why is it different if I write in Mitch Daniels who will probably get fewer votes?
I don’t find the arguments bad, I find them to exist in a cocoon of sorts. Yes, four years isn’t a long time, and we will have another election, and Flight 93 is a tad histrionic for my tastes. But Democrats are saying “we want to change the system so Republicans can’t win elections” and the reaction seems to be “pish posh, Joe Biden isn’t as prone to bluster and will show them the better angels of their nature.” The entire argument of the anti-Trump Republican is that Trump lies, but don’t believe what the Democrats say, especially because Joe Biden, who has never sniffed the hair of the truth, seems reasonable.
40 percent of what you want is better than zero. But I’m a transactional voter, not one involved in hero worship.
But here is where I start to get angry. Four years also isn’t a short amount of time. If Biden wins, no one in the commentariat loses anything. milquetoast conservatives will still put out their columns, and those who overrate themselves uniquely contrarian will still be paid by the publications that employ them. I left my job in 2019 for a career change in a growing economy. In 2008, the department heads where I worked were corralled into a meeting the day after election day in anticipation of higher taxes where they could cut “overhead.” Overhead where I worked was support staff. If you’ve never had to sit through people being marched out by building security with a Human Resources professional giving false comfort with “don’t worry, we’ll box your stuff up and ship it to your home,” I envy you.
It’s easy to be the “party of ideas” when all you have to generate are ideas. Republicans in 2016 were scared to use political capital to get those ideas done. That’s why Paul Ryan had to get out, that’s why Republicans were voted out. Ideas people will say “suburban women don’t like that Trump’s a poopy head” but your rank and file voter was like “where’s that healthcare plan you had been planning since day one after ACA was passed” which ironically is what the ideas shop is bagging on Trump for, and last I checked, domestic policy mostly resides in Congress. We found the experts hired to do jobs of cleaning out agencies of excess were prone to the same excess and eventually the administration started hiring better.
But the ideas people weren’t being asked for their ideas, and Donald Trump would leverage his political capital far more than he should have on Free Trade, on Justice Reform, on other issues that were not the pillars of conservatism. Experts were upset that their expertise wasn’t expertly being experted by the hoi polloi who had started to take positions after consultant class failure. Normal people are coming into my country club? Use the old china and make sure they only get 15 minutes in the pool and have it scrubbed.
People paid for what they think don’t have to face a market where what you can do matters. They’re paid for supposed brilliance. Some consultant who stumbles on an election he’s not supposed to win 35 years ago is elevated to a Svengali who can tell you how to repeat that magic and buys bigger houses for the next three decades because of it. People like me have to think of a way to fudge qualifications on a resume to make middle age seem appealing to an employer in one of our “approved” industries if one party gets to regulate industry instead of allowing business to operate.
I’m still low man on the totem pole at the new job. I can’t afford to not work for four years if the recovery stagnates underneath taxes and regulation and a great reset and “more fair” hiring which as a white old man means I’m picked last for kickball.
I already have one party that doesn’t care if I live or die, I don’t need two.
That, in essence, makes it a binary choice for me. I don’t like Trump all that much save for attacking the garbage media, but I have more disdain for people who I thought agreed with me on most things that also think the most vacuous politician for the past 40 years will be a good lesson for all us in moral character. Especially those who will blame the voter for the laziness of a party that coasted on being loyal opposition, merely stating the case for their ideas versus actually trying to put them in action, and finding out all along no plans were made.
You can tell me the Republican Party will be better if Trump loses. I have my doubts. I will tell you that I was told Tom Price had a health care plan that would be ready on day one and saw a bunch of House Republicans scared by a media class with no interest in their success.
But then again, we might not have to worry about it. We’ll conserve all these new rules put upon us.
Reply by wonder2wonder
on November 2, 2020 at 3:41 PM
Who are Berman and Braga?
From Wikipedia:
... Rick Berman
... Brannon Braga
Reply by Nexus71
on November 2, 2020 at 10:28 PM
That's not the topic of this thread
Reply by Nexus71
on November 2, 2020 at 10:36 PM
The ST09 movie was OK and I wouldn't have been bothered if they didn't back down with doing something new with the stories in this new alternate universe but all they could do is bring back memberberries by bringing in Khan in movie 2 (funny thing now that J.J. made Khan a white male while he is now full of diversity and SJW shit that hypocrite).With the third movie I have less issues(even though the Beastie Boys thing in the finale was fun but plain stupid) since it actually tried to do something new as the second movie should have been.And that is my biggest issue with new Star Trek in general they could have gone for the whole J.J. clean slate option of the "Kelvin-Universe" and based on past shows could have created a complete new version of Star Trek but greedy as they are they wanted the built in fan base of the older incarnation of Star Trek so they brought in too many things from the past and that wouldn't have been so cringe worthy if they didn't use those to subvert previously established Star Trek history and trying to rewrite history because of some SJW infused redactive agenda and even that wouldn't be a thing if the writers had the knowledge ,skills,creativity and experience to do this in an intelligent,entertaining ,engaing and thought provoking manner as the original Trek use to do .And because of that Star Trek now is reduced to the 21st Century equivalent of soapbox(partisan) politics where all we get is cookie cutter cut out characters who are so insultingly cliché that it is offensive to any person with half a brain and certainly to life long Star Trek fans.Plus it also doesn't help that fans have to endure the continuous name calling and insulting of fans by the likes of Kurtzman,Chabon, Wheaton,Stewart,Frakes and now Sirtis in various media outlets where we get scorned for not watching their shows even though we were told by the very same people these shows were not meant for us but hey I guess that white privilege and entitlement only works in one direction.
Reply by Nexus71
on November 3, 2020 at 2:54 AM
Star Trek Discovery the most popular show in the entire world ??? You are joking I assume because it is most certainly not ,not by a long shot otherwise it would be in Netflix on line Top 50 of most watched shows or it would pop up in the Trending list on Netflix (I am a subscriber so I would know) and it isn't so there is no basis for that claim other than repeating what the folks at Secret Hideout and their paid media shills are saying.Besides there are far more popular shows than Discovery like The Mandalorian,The Witcher,Stranger Things or Cobra Kai. Also even now when Discovery is on normal TV for free people aren't watching it like I wrote in my post on the STD board the first episode of season 1 got 1.7-1.8 million viewers (and it isn't the most watched TV program of that day )and it has already dropped off by 25% after episode 5 with barely 1.3 million viewers. So NO Invidia Discovery is far from being the most popular show streaming even some of the access media have already accepted that Discovery is a ratings disaster but seems you didn't get that memo.
And now back to Enterprise back to the OT
Reply by Nexus71
on November 3, 2020 at 8:58 AM
Nope the most popular shows streaming(globally) on Netflix are Stranger Things ,The Witcher and Cobra Kai and even Disney + The Mandalorian is more popular than Discovery and I am probably forgetting some shows on Amazon and HBO because I haven 'got numbers from there but even the top 50 of most watched shows on Amazon(globally) doesn't have any Picard in it in fact the only show they Mention is Star Trek TOS and on Netflix the only Star Trek shows that have appeared in the Top 50 over the past year are TNG,DS9 or VOY .So No Invidia the numbers and statistics don't lie Discovery is not popular at all.In fact last week 's numbers show that Discovery is 14th on the list of most streamed shows in the US (based on the numbers CBS All Access gives ).
https://www.pcmag.com/news/the-most-watched-shows-on-netflix-this-week
https://observer.com/2020/08/netflix-ratings-most-watched-original-licensed-shows-what-to-stream/
https://www.mentalfloss.com/article/609628/netflix-most-watched-shows-2019
https://thetab.com/uk/2020/07/17/most-watched-netflix-shows-ever-167036
Reply by Philippe LeMarchand
on November 3, 2020 at 5:35 PM
Member Berries.
Is this:
?
Less frivolously:
It's all a bit moot as if any of the current Trek shows weren't making a profit, they'd be canned. Ergo, whether the ratings are high or low, they are currently making enough to warrant further production. Besides, since when have ratings been an indicator of quality?
BTW none of those lists include Into The Night, which was a huge hit and has had a second season commissioned. Admittedly, it must be a lot cheaper than any Trek show as it has a small cast (that grows smaller as the show progresses) and not much more than one set (or three if you count the plane's seating area, cockpit and hold as separate).
Reply by Nexus71
on November 4, 2020 at 12:22 AM
Meanwhile back to the OT
Reply by Nexus71
on November 4, 2020 at 11:38 AM
WHERE ARE THE NUMBERS TO PROVE THIS CLAIM OF SCREEN RANT INVIDIA???(WHICH BY THE WAY IS OWNED BY CBS)/THIS IS EXACTLY MY POINT I GIVE SUBSTANTIATED EVIDENCE BY STATING FACTS FIGURES AND NUMBERS TO PROVE MY POINT BUT YOU KEEP CLAIMING OTHERWISE BASED ON SOME BIASED PROMOTION ARTICLE WITH NO NUMBERS TO SUBSTANTIATE THE CLAIMS .WHY ARE YOU SO NAIVE TO ACCEPT EVERYTHING THESE SITES CLAIM AT FACE VALUE WHILE THEY HAVE BEEN KNOWN TO TAKE THE TRUTH ON A PROVERBIAL RIDE.AND MAYBE DISCOVERY IS THE MOST WATCHED STREAMING SHOW ON CBS ALL ACCESS IT STILL DOESN'T MAKE THAT DISCOVERY THE MOST WATCHED STREAMED SHOW IN THE WORLD BECAUSE THAT IS BLATANTLY UNTRUE YOU ARE SELLING NONSENSE IF A SHOW DOESN'T APPEAR IN THE TOP 50 OF MOST WATCHED SHOW ON NETFLIX(WHICH IS THE WORLDS LARGEST STREAMING SERVICE)THEN THAT CLAIM IS FALSE PERIOD IF YOU CAN'T DO MATH YOU SHOULDN'T EVEN TRY TO CONTEST THE ARGUMENT BECAUSE YOU WILL LOOSE THAT ARGUMENT SIMPLY BASED ON NUMBERS AND STATISTICS.SO FOR THE LAST TIME NO DISCOVERY IS NOT THE MOST WATCHED STREAMING SHOW IN THE WORLD NOT BY A LONG SHOT STOP REFERRING TO ARTICLES THAT HAVE NO NUMBERS OR STATS TO SUBSTANTIATE YOUR CLAIM OTHERWISE IT IS POINTLESS IN ARGUING.
(also noted that in the Screen Rant article they talk about that by 2019 that CBS All Access had reached it target of 4 million subscribers by 2020 which is also false the target was to get 8 million subscribers by 2020 so they are now doing some redactive reporting because you and I even discussed this target of 8 million in the past,besides how can a streaming service of only 4 million subscribers compete with a streaming service that has over 180 million subscribers Worldwide.And even though CBS All Access has 4 million subscribers who is to say that all of those 4 million subscribed to watch Star Trek?)
AND FOR THE LAST TIME THIS THREAD IS ABOUT ENTERPRISE STOP BRINGING DISCOVERY TO DISCUSSIONS ON BOARDS DESIGNATED TO THE ENTERPRISE AND OTHER STAR TREK BOARDS.I KNOW YOU ARE DESPERATE FOR ATTENTION FOR YOUR PRECIOUS MIKEY SPOCK WORSHIP BUT NO NOBODY IS BUYING THE BULLSHIT YOU AND OTHER DISCOVERY TROLLS KEEP SPOUTING AND NOBODY CAReS ABOUT DISCOVERY OTHERWISE DISCOVERY WOULD BE THE MOST POPULAR STAR TREK BOARD AND IT ISN'T SO FOR THE FINAL TIME........
MEANWHILE BACK TO THE OT.
Reply by Nexus71
on November 4, 2020 at 1:43 PM
I at least gave numbers and lists of most watched shows where are your numbers Invidia???That you like STD fine but why do you come here every time somebody says something negative about the show why do you even bother the react to my posts when you know damn well you are not going to persuade me and others to change their opinion.This is exactly how you STD fans behave on every social media platform every time somebody doesn't like the show they come and harass them.Like I said that you like the show fine and power to you but stop bullying those who don't share your opinion or when they have something negative to say about the show.You can like the show all that you want and believe all the things that you read in some articles but don't come here and lecture us stop being so arrogant to think that you know everything when you aren't even familiar with basic Star Trek lore and the the things that are going on behind the scenes and in the the entertainment industry as a whole why else do you think these type of discussions aren't a thing limited to the Star Trek franchise alone.
And here ends the discussion for me now go off to your precious STD board and claim whatever you want there .
Meanwhile back to the OT.
Reply by Nexus71
on November 4, 2020 at 5:37 PM
Meanwhile back to the OT