@lineker said:

Both Lucy and The Lady are English/French co-productions and in those cases it's a simple decision to go for English.

No this is wrong: "Lucy" is a 100% French production, please refer to reliable source. While "The Lady" is effectively French/UK co-production.

I am sorry but I still do not understand what means your field "original language". If it corresponds to the country of production you should change the label and allow multiple Countries entry. By the way, why a French production, English speaking like Lucy is correctly set to Original language = English, while the movie of J.J. Annaud, a French/UK/Vietnam production, English speaking also, is set to French. Still don't get it.

This is very confusing for users, and it does not help to contribute to the database.

Thanks,

You are correct. I failed to notice that american executive producer Marc Shmuger is the CEO of Besson's production company. Sorry about that.

I am sorry but I still do not understand what means your field "original language".

It is just a setting to get a general feel for the movie. Is this a French movie? Is this an American movie? Is this a Swedish movie? Spoken language and/or who produced it can factor in, but not really. Would you say Lucy is a French movie or that it is an American movie? Would you say The Lady is a French movie or a British movie? Would you say The Lover is a French movie or an American movie? I would actually consider having all of them listed as original language French based on that, but what do you think? Remember it has nothing to do with spoken language. If Steven Spielberg made a documentary in Arabic, we would not say that it is an Arabic movie, but that it is an American documentary. That is the thinking. (But still tricky and that's understandable.)

Hi, Lucy is a French movie. The Lady is a French/UK movie. The Lover is a French/UK/Vietnam movie. And all 3 are original language English. That's all and that's simple. Don't need to bother. You are holding a database so you need objective, complete and undiscutable criteria that fits all the data. A lot of movies are co-producted by two or more countries. Look at the wikipedia database format: there is a field for "country of origin" which is much more explicit than your "original language" label, and moreover it allows multiple country entries which is mandatory for many movies. So my last advice should be to change the field label of your database and to allow a list of countries, not only one. And keep the original language as the main spoken language of the movie. But last, I don't understand why do we spend so much time for discussing on that little point, while you should better simply accept user contribution to improve your database content (is that your goal ?)... I own a thousand original DVD and Blu-ray and I know very much all of my movies. I wanted to start to improve some data in your database but after this experience, I give up! Sorry and good luck.

@beaudu That's the "Production Countries" field under "Production Information"

@beaudu said: the original language as the main spoken language of the movie.

it's my opinion , too, when everybody in the film talks arabic then this should be the original language , that has nothing to do which language the director speaks or where the company comes from, just my point of view

I think it's more related to spoken languages than production countries. I think travis said something like something like that too. Maybe we should point him to third thread, to look at those movies mentioned, wether it should be French or English?

Yes, then you assume that the default use for such a movie would be for Arabic users, which is fine. But I don't think it is what Travis intended. If it was as simple as just take spoken language and add it as original language, then we wouldn't need to have a conversation at all. Unfortunately, it is more complex than that...

So a movie in a made-up language should be added as the made-up language for original language? Sorry, but I fail to see the logic here.

I had a problem in the past with the original language field of a co-production (french-spanish) I think and I set it to french and was told by lineker that it should be set to spanish because most of the actors were spanish, so I think it should be the majority of the language that was spoken in the movie but the other possibility could be that in a co-production they all agreed to speak english on the set so the movie has the original language english but how can you find out ?

I wanted to start to improve some data in your database but after this experience, I give up!

This is a typical troll comment. I wonder what would have happened the 100 first times I came across an obstacle here. Oh, well, I guess i did care about contributing a bit more than that. I'm sorry that you give up, but you obviously didn't bother to read the comments by Travis in the other thread or you wouldn't have made such a comment. But Marr is correct, let Travis decide again.

Here we have the perfect example movie. City of Ghosts, part of this year's U.S. Documentary Competition (not World Documentary, but U.S. since it's not an Arabic production). https://www.themoviedb.org/movie/428501

It is a US movie production made by a US director and original movie language is set to English. This matches the original title which is in English. Spoken language is Arabic.

(I'll post this example to Travis on the internal forum.)

We're still waiting for an answer but, to be clear:

• The original language is not the language of the title (even though it matches most of the time)
• The original language is not the main language spoken in the original version of the movie (even though it matches most of the time)
• The original language has nothing to do with the original country (I don't understand that one?)

And @lineker you think that:

• The original language is not the main production language of the movie (as in the language of the script, the original credits, the original posters, the original press releases, etc.)
• The original language is not used to differentiate the "original" overview and tagline from the translated overview and tagline
• The location of the main production company basically trumps everything else (spoken language, language of production)?

What if a 100% Spanish or Native American production company is located in the US and produce movies 100% in their native languages?

The original language is the main language spoken in the original version of the movie that's my opinion, I know it's not the general one here, but I stay with it

The original language is not the main production language of the movie (as in the language of the script, the original credits, the original posters, the original press releases, etc.)

Actually that is exactly what I do think (in 99 percent of the cases). Maybe I haven't been very clear here. Matthew Heineman and his US production company makes a documentary about the Syria crisis. Only Arabic is spoken in the movie, but all what you mention above is in English for this movie. And most importantly: the movie is referred to as an American movie, not an Arabic one: original language English.

Let's use a 1 percent example. Lars von Trier is always produced by a Danish production company (co-producers come from all over the world). He is a Danish filmmaker. I have no problem calling his movies Danish, even though most of the above would be in English for his English language movies. I could let go of this position if it would be easier for all to reach a joint position.

I think the problem here is that original language is not yet used in any way. It's just a data point.

What if a 100% Spanish or Native American production company is located in the US and produce movies 100% in their native languages?

It depends. Using the Spanish example, would people refer to their movies as American movies or Spanish movies? Probably Spanish? is L'Amant a French movie? Yes? No? That's more of where I'm going with this.

The original language is the main language spoken in the original version of the movie that's my opinion, I know it's not the general one here, but I stay with it

And I will stay with my position. It will be confusing for the users, but until an official decision that's how it will have to be.

(My Internet has been gone for 10 hours in case you wonder where I've been today.)

Actually that is exactly what I do think (in 99 percent of the cases).

I agree that for documentaries the spoken language 100% does not matter. But in the case of french movies produced in English for an English/worlwide market (and later dubbed in french) I kind of assumed the language language of "production"( script, original credits, original posters, original press releases) is English and that's what very confusing to me? Like if France made a world war II movie and the spoken language was mostly German, I wouldn't assume the language of production is German, but English is maybe a bit different (to me).

Let's use a 1 percent example. Lars von Trier is always produced by a Danish production company (co-producers come from all over the world). He is a Danish filmmaker. I have no problem calling his movies Danish

Thanks! That makes it clear. For the record, my priority is 100% clear guidelines. I really want to know what Travis thinks!