Discuss Surrogates

That was a critical action to consider and then execute with very little consideration of the ramifications.

Surrogates are essentially running society world wide and you decide to just shut the system down just like that.

What about surrogates performing critical tasks like surgeries, piloting, driving 18 wheelers on a highway, oil drilling...etc. That kind of a shut-down doesn't just affect the surrogates. It places human lives in great danger...perhaps death.

The one part of the movie that made no sense and was actually ridiculously stupid. The first thing I would have expected to see are airplanes dropping from the sky and crashing to earth once all of the surrogate pilots are suddenly turned offline.

13 replies (on page 1 of 1)

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@Nubyan, you appear to have a good point!

I don't remember how this movie ended - whenever I get around to seeing it again (likely this weekend), I'll circle back to either fully echo your sentiments or share any tidbit that might mitigate what otherwise could have been a major flaw. I have a few issues with this movie myself but need a fresh viewing to be able to speak to them fairly.

They spent so much time perfecting Surrogates, they never bothered with self driving cars/planes.

Priorities, people!

@DRDMovieMusings said:

@Nubyan, you appear to have a good point!

I don't remember how this movie ended - whenever I get around to seeing it again (likely this weekend), I'll circle back to either fully echo your sentiments or share any tidbit that might mitigate what otherwise could have been a major flaw. I have a few issues with this movie myself but need a fresh viewing to be able to speak to them fairly.

Looking forward to hearing from you.

@Nubyan said:

Looking forward to hearing from you.

OK, so, it appears to make some sense within the movie itself. Should I explain it or leave you to watch it again and pay closer attention to the dialog? (I do not mean to come across as condescending at all - I honestly don't want to spoil it for you if you wanted to get it within the viewing of the movie.)

@DRDMovieMusings said:

OK, so, it appears to make some sense within the movie itself. Should I explain it or leave you to watch it again and pay closer attention to the dialog? (I do not mean to come across as condescending at all - I honestly don't want to spoil it for you if you wanted to get it within the viewing of the movie.)

No. And you aren't being condescending at all. I appreciate the feedback. Sometimes we miss things while watching a film. Give me some time to check it out again. In the end, you may need to share your insight. But I'll let you know.

Thanks DRD...

@Nubyan said:

@DRDMovieMusings said:

OK, so, it appears to make some sense within the movie itself. Should I explain it or leave you to watch it again and pay closer attention to the dialog? (I do not mean to come across as condescending at all - I honestly don't want to spoil it for you if you wanted to get it within the viewing of the movie.)

No. And you aren't being condescending at all. I appreciate the feedback. Sometimes we miss things while watching a film. Give me some time to check it out again. In the end, you may need to share your insight. But I'll let you know.

Thanks DRD...

Cool, mate. Do keep in mind, it wasn't perfectly executed, so I still think you have a point. But, I think you'll agree they tried to speak to your concern. Looking forward to your circling back :-)

@DRDMovieMusings Okay, so it's been awhile. I finally got around to watching the movie again. And, I'm still perplexed by the ending. Am I stupid? I just don't see how catastrophic accidents aren't happening all over the world.

I will need your insight.

@Nubyan said:

@DRDMovieMusings Okay, so it's been awhile. I finally got around to watching the movie again. And, I'm still perplexed by the ending. Am I stupid? I just don't see how catastrophic accidents aren't happening all over the world.

I will need your insight.

Nah, you're not stupid! I'll watch it again, get back up to speed, and circle back soon...

Thanks. Can't wait to hear back from you. But, take your time if needed.

@Nubyan said:

Thanks. Can't wait to hear back from you. But, take your time if needed.

Okay, so, the movie's attempt to address our concern happens during the final scene with Greer confronting Cantor.

TL:DR - Canter says that surrogacy is an addiction and, to kill the addiction requires killing the addict. That's basically it!

About Canter

Cantor invented surrogates with one intention in mind, and it became something else. Instead of granting people a new sense of dignity and humanity, it seemed to have the opposite effect, an inhumanity that Greer had been coming to himself. In Canter's mind, not only must the surrogate system itself be destroyed but, for humanity to have a chance at reset, all those who were connected to their surrogates, living out their addiction, also had to die. So, yes, there would have been planes falling out of the sky, etc. All the surrogates, and all the operators behind them sitting in stem chairs at home, would all have died. He doesn't see anyone using a surrogate as innocent, he sees them as hopeless, so getting rid of them all is not bad, in his view.

That's part of why he'd built, through his "prophet" surrogate, a community of people - disconnected from the surrogate system, connected to themselves and each other - to restart humanity once all the addicted operators had died with his surrogate virus poison pill (and he literally took one himself, demonstrating some sense of integrity, some willingness to sacrifice for some perceived greater good, which was always his motivation. Canter is a tragic character). Only those who had been awake enough to choose to disconnect, were worthy of being the basis for the new rehumanity.

Interestingly, actor James Cromwell played a somewhat similar role in I,Robot - the doctor who set it all up and then had to find a way to destroy it because it got out of hand.

About Greer

Just after Canter, operating Peters' synth unit, used the device to kill Andrew Stone's unit and him in reality, Greer jumped into Canter's stem chair and took over the Peters' unit. He gets the system operator Saunders to explain how they need to interrupt Canter's poison pill, and it's revealed that they can do it two steps: first, buffer the operators from their synth units, and then stop the destruction of the synth units. Greer takes matters into his own hands, buffering the operators from whatever might happen to the synth units, and then deciding to allow the destruction of the synth units. He hits the no button just before the Peters unit gets shot.

Now, all those planes can crash, but the human operators at home are safe. Canter's vision for a restart can now include all people, because the "addicts" that Canter had dismissed included people who were just hurting from some traumatic experience, people like Greer and, in a different way, his wife Maggie. Not all addicts are worthless and hopeless for change.

WTF is the story with Strickland?

So, what do you think? Rest assured that, even if all the aforementioned is plausible, it still doesn't answer all the questions about this movie - I'm still trying to figure out Strickland!

A great line

There's a scene in which a security guard says "Greer, you look terrible." And Greer says, "Thanks, so do you." That actually made me chuckle - the guard think's Greer walking around in the flesh and being all beaten up looks bad, but Greer says "thanks" because he feels human, alive, real - he doesn't take it as an insult, rather a compliment. Then he says "so do you" asserting that hiding behind the synth is terrible but, of course, the guard is unlikely to get it.

@DRDMovieMusings: Thank you so much for one...taking the time to re-watch the move in so little time, you didn't have to, but it was great that you did. And, two...for explaining the flaw. To the point that it makes sense. I'm forever grateful! I absolutely love positive experiences and discussions like these on this board.

Ahh, Strickland. He was simply a tool. Beyond that, I can't think of anything else.

I remember the scene you speak of regarding the "you look terrible" line. Yeah, I thought the same. Especially after they revealed that one of the human host looked like jabba the hutt from Star Wars and that his surrogate was some thin blonde chick. I guess he was fulfilling a life long dream of who he really thought he should be.

Yes, I've watched I, Robot about a dozen times. It is interesting that Cromwell's character in both movies are similar in their attempt to right a wrong.

Again, thank you so much. We are on some of the same boards, so I know I'll run in to you again. If memory serves me right, it's always a pleasure.

@Nubyan said:

@DRDMovieMusings: Thank you so much for one...taking the time to re-watch the move in so little time, you didn't have to, but it was great that you did. And, two...for explaining the flaw. To the point that it makes sense. I'm forever grateful! I absolutely love positive experiences and discussions like these on this board.

Ahh, Strickland. He was simply a tool. Beyond that, I can't think of anything else.

I remember the scene you speak of regarding the "you look terrible" line. Yeah, I thought the same. Especially after they revealed that one of the human host looked like jabba the hutt from Star Wars and that his surrogate was some thin blonde chick. I guess he was fulfilling a life long dream of who he really thought he should be.

Yes, I've watched I, Robot about a dozen times. It is interesting that Cromwell's character in both movies are similar in their attempt to right a wrong.

Again, thank you so much. We are on some of the same boards, so I know I'll run in to you again. If memory serves me right, it's always a pleasure.

I am, in your words, a fellow "IMDb refugee" :-) who also appreciates good discussions, and want to contribute to offsetting some of the crap that happens on this board with good discussions such as this one, so many thanks to you, too - see you around!

@DRDMovieMusings I am, in your words, a fellow "IMDb refugee" :-) who also appreciates good discussions, and want to contribute to offsetting some of the crap that happens on this board with good discussions such as this one, so many thanks to you, too - see you around!

You are a shepherd. We need more of you. Looking forward to future engagements. 😊

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